Manipulation and Controversy: The Dark Side of Gypsy Rose Blanchard's Life

This podcast episode delves into the tragic and complex life of Gypsy Rose Blanchard, born on July 27, 1991. The story begins with her parents, Rod and Dee Dee, who met in high school and separated shortly before Gypsy's birth. Dee Dee quickly began fabricating illnesses for Gypsy, starting with a claim of sleep apnea when Gypsy was just three months old. As Gypsy grew, Dee Dee expanded her lies, alleging that Gypsy had leukemia and muscular dystrophy, which led to years of unnecessary medical treatments.

In 2005, after Hurricane Katrina destroyed their home, Dee Dee used the disaster to further manipulate Gypsy's identity, claiming all her medical records were lost. This lie allowed Dee Dee to continue controlling Gypsy's life, even convincing the world that Gypsy was much younger than her true age.

The story takes a dark turn in 2015 when Gypsy, desperate to escape her mother's abuse, conspires with her then-boyfriend, Nicholas Godejohn, to murder Dee Dee. After the murder, Gypsy's shocking post on Dee Dee's Facebook account alerted authorities, leading to their arrest. Gypsy pleaded guilty to second-degree murder in 2016 and was sentenced to 10 years in prison, while Godejohn was sentenced to life without parole.

The episode also explores Gypsy's life after prison. Released in December 2023 after serving eight years, she quickly remarried but filed for divorce just months later. Gypsy reconnected with her ex-fiancé, Ken Urker, and the couple is now expecting their first child in January 2025.

takeaways

• Gypsy Rose Blanchard's life was marked by manipulation and abuse at the hands of her mother, Dee Dee.
• Gypsy orchestrated the murder of her mother with the help of her boyfriend, Nicholas Godejohn.
• She pled guilty to second-degree murder and served 10 years in prison.
• Since her release, Gypsy has faced criticism and controversy, particularly regarding her level of involvement in the crime and her behavior on social media. Gypsy Rose Blanchard's life after prison has been filled with drama and controversy.
• She quickly gained a following on social media but faced criticism for her behavior.
• Her marriage to Ryan ended in divorce just three months after her release.
• There are concerns about her manipulation and the influence of those around her.

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• 19:22 (Cont.) Manipulation and Controversy: The Dark Side of Gypsy Rose Blanchard's Life

Transcript

We Wine Whenever (00:01.496)
to WeWine whenever, I'm Wendy.

Kelli (00:03.758)
I'm Kelly.

Lori (00:04.909)
And I'm Lori.

We Wine Whenever (00:06.84)
Today we're talking about Gypsy Rose Blanchard. So I started watching, yes, I started watching on Lifetime by accident, Life After Lockup with Gypsy Rose. And I thought, gee, this is interesting. And then I said, I need to find out what the backstory is on this. So then I found the Mommy Deadly Deer, or whatever it was called, Deadly,

Lori (00:12.395)
Yes, Miss Gypsy Rose.

Kelli (00:26.577)
Mm -hmm.

We Wine Whenever (00:37.816)
There was a backstory.

Kelli (00:38.961)
And that was on Max, right? HBO Max. Okay, so those are the two things I watched. I watched the Max one first, which was good because I knew nothing about this. I'm sure I heard about it when it happened, but it scares me. So I wouldn't have paid attention to it. And then I watched the Life After Lockup on lifetime.

We Wine Whenever (00:41.994)
Yeah, I believe so.

We Wine Whenever (00:57.421)
And then I found there's one in between there and it's confessionals while she's in prison. And they interviewed her and they talked to her for 18 months while she was in prison.

Lori (01:10.629)
That one I watched. Mm -hmm, yes. And I watched.

Kelli (01:11.131)
Did you watch that, Laura?

Kelli (01:15.258)
Okay.

We Wine Whenever (01:15.285)
okay that's the one you is that the only when you watch

Lori (01:18.081)
No, I also watched a bunch of stuff on YouTube and I watched some of the one when she gets out of... Yeah, a little bit of life after lockup.

Kelli (01:24.945)
There's a lot on YouTube.

We Wine Whenever (01:31.916)
Okay, yeah. So, I have a timeline here so we can kind of go off of that. So she was born on July 27th, 1991, Gypsy Rose. that's weird. 1991. So she's 32 years old now. So Gypsy's parents are Rod and Dee Dee, and they first met when he was in high school. Rod was in high school. Dee Dee got pregnant.

Lori (01:33.699)
Yeah, whatever.

Kelli (01:42.583)
to Eric's birthday. What year?

We Wine Whenever (02:00.14)
And so they got married, but this is very interesting. Rod was 17 at the time and Dee Dee was 24.

Kelli (02:09.329)
that's that it seemed like there was a big age difference but I didn't realize it was that big.

We Wine Whenever (02:13.643)
Yep, yep, they eventually separated shortly before Gypsy was born in July. So they got married for a short time. He realized that, you know, he wasn't in love with her. He just got married to her because that's what you're supposed to do. he was a kid. And technically, I'll be honest with you, that's statutory rape. Like she was 24. So, you know, this. Yeah, this poor girl's life did not even start off well.

Kelli (02:29.446)
Yeah.

Kelli (02:33.871)
for sure.

Lori (02:34.402)
absolutely.

Kelli (02:38.288)
Yeah.

Kelli (02:42.49)
Now.

We Wine Whenever (02:43.658)
So then when Gypsy was three months old, her mom believed that she had sleep apnea and she began taking her to the hospital. Three months old. Like her entire life she was doing this to her. The doctors did several tests. They didn't find anything wrong, but I don't know, somehow she got her the sleep apnea machine. And you know, for a very long time she was

Kelli (02:58.779)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (03:12.136)
the victim of Munchausen's by proxy, know, claiming that she had leukemia, muscular dystrophy, all these crazy things.

Kelli (03:14.352)
Yeah.

Kelli (03:20.657)
And doctors, I mean, I guess the mother was very persuasive because doctors started treating her, which is crazy. Crazy. I mean, you can't say that she has a...

We Wine Whenever (03:30.845)
Yeah, it is crazy.

Lori (03:31.075)
Well, it did come out that she...

Lori (03:39.045)
It did come out that she has some kind of chromosomal problem, which did relate to several surgeries that it, per her medical records, from what I have read, that she did have to have some procedures done. the man chosen, whatever you would say it by proxy, is kind of more towards, people say like more towards the 60 -40 range.

We Wine Whenever (04:01.223)
Munchausen, Munchausen by proxy.

Lori (04:07.589)
because 40 % of it, she did have a chromosomal disease that did lead to her needing some surgeries. Because I kept thinking to myself, in what world does this exist that she can just like have her kid get all these surgeries when they weren't medically like, that doesn't happen consecutively for years. just, no doctor's gonna do that. You'll get sued, like, no. So it turns out, supposedly,

Kelli (04:21.581)
Exactly.

Kelli (04:33.241)
Right. Right. Right.

Lori (04:37.507)
that she did have to have several of these surgeries and that a lot of people think she's a lot more complicit in it than.

Kelli (04:45.217)
just be a doctor trying to cover their ass though.

We Wine Whenever (04:49.989)
Well, she did have an eye issue. do know that the eye surgeries that she had

Lori (04:50.509)
I dunno, she does have the chromosomal disease.

Lori (04:56.013)
Yeah, I'm not saying she didn't have any surgeries that weren't.

We Wine Whenever (04:57.551)
Yeah, I mean, I think the

Kelli (05:02.349)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I know what you're saying. I'm just saying that a doctor could just say this now because because I mean, that's unbelievable that she had all of these unwarranted surgeries.

We Wine Whenever (05:16.187)
Well, the biggest problem was really that the mother got her that feeding tube. And that's really where, you know, that feeding tube is what led her to be able to drug her or stop feeding her or making her appear to be failure to thrive and, you know, giving her whatever medicine she wanted through that, that feeding tube. And that's really the way her mother controlled her is, is through that.

Lori (05:36.421)
Yeah.

Kelli (05:43.941)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (05:46.29)
and isolating her and not allowing her father to know the truth about her and telling the father that she had all these things wrong with her. And then telling Gypsy when she was a little bit older that your father looks at you weird and he's embarrassed of you and doesn't know how to take care of you.

Kelli (05:48.359)
Yeah.

Kelli (05:52.174)
Right.

Kelli (06:07.129)
Yeah, like I know that man has some guilt, but I don't think that woman would have made anything easy on him if he tried to be more of a part of her life.

We Wine Whenever (06:16.974)
No, no, he definitely, I mean, there's nothing that he could have done.

Lori (06:17.697)
no, would have been very difficult. She would have fought him tooth and nail.

Yeah. And did you see from the crime scene photos, there was an actual medicine cabinet that they found that was like out of control, like a lot of medication in it.

Kelli (06:23.205)
Yeah, for sure, for sure.

Kelli (06:38.639)
Yeah, yeah. I mean the house was... I mean she was clearly a hoarder, that woman.

We Wine Whenever (06:46.328)
Yeah. Yeah. And all the wheelchairs throughout the house. I mean, she definitely, you know, she definitely had issues and she was definitely manipulating the system. you know, people say a lot of, a lot of people still have a lot of hate for Gypsy Rose because they think that she got away with murder. They think that she manipulated Nicholas Gojjan, the guy who actually killed her mother.

into doing it because he was autistic and he had his own mental health issues. But I don't necessarily think that's the case. I mean, I do think there was some sort of manipulation because that's all she knew. That's how she grew up. Her mother was manipulating the system. So that's how she knew how to get things done. But, you know, he did it, you know, and he had a criminal mind. He had already talked to

Lori (07:35.033)
Yes. But that doesn't negate.

Lori (07:44.665)
Good, Wendy, sorry.

We Wine Whenever (07:47.15)
That doesn't negate what?

Lori (07:50.115)
that, you know...

I don't know, I just don't think that she's, I think she's a lot more complacent in the actual planning and execution of her mother's murder than she wants to admit. I don't think that it's necessarily her fault, but I think she definitely got to a point where she knew, you know, my mom's not gonna let me be with guys. She knew what,

the kind of scam her mom was running. you know, it's just this thing where she's, and it's all her mother's fault. I'm not saying it's her fault, but it's this thing where she's, you know, 23 years old.

Kelli (08:36.675)
No, it's all her mother's fault. I think we can all agree on

Lori (08:40.329)
absolutely, but what I'm saying is I just think that she's a little more complacent than she wants to admit. I mean, you make a video.

Kelli (08:51.887)
her part in it, like her

Lori (08:55.557)
Well, look, she makes a video of doing stabbing motions, telling him how to kill her mom. She's 23 and in, you know, one day she can be at Disney World in a princess costume, eating mashed potatoes like she's has, you know, all kinds of physical ailments and mental deficiencies. But then the next day she's online posting pictures of herself as Ruby.

Kelli (09:03.387)
She did?

We Wine Whenever (09:04.511)
Yes.

Lori (09:24.865)
in kind of like a little bit of an S outfit. And the video that was made after her mother was killed and they were in that hotel room. To me, that's... I'm just saying she has a lot more problems than I think...

Kelli (09:27.663)
Yeah.

Kelli (09:37.99)
Right.

Lori (09:45.765)
that it has been presented as. Like, I don't think she should have gotten out without mandatory, intense therapy, not being, you know, not being able to make money off of the social media.

We Wine Whenever (09:51.658)
Well, that's the thing. Yeah.

Kelli (09:57.083)
Hopefully she got that. I was just thinking that. I agree with you.

Lori (10:01.85)
You what?

Kelli (10:03.439)
That's a problem.

We Wine Whenever (10:03.584)
So, well, let me just tell you this. This is what happened. making money off social media. So this is what happened. So she was in jail and she asked for therapy and they denied her therapy. And the reason I know this is because when she got out of jail, she said that she wanted to work on prison reform and she put that out there and she mentioned Kim Kardashian's name. So Kim Kardashian flew out to meet with Gypsy Rose and she sat there in front of her.

Kelli (10:06.747)
what you just said, that's a problem. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (10:33.599)
And Gypsy said to her, I give you a lot of credit for even talking to me because people don't want to touch me with a 10 foot pole. She goes, but I really do want to help make the system better. You know, I know what I did was wrong. I know I need therapy. I asked for therapy when I was in jail and they said that they didn't think I needed therapy, individual therapy. Now how, well,

Kelli (10:56.945)
That sounds crazy to me. That sounds crazy to me that they would deny her therapy. Yeah. She orchestrated the murder of her mother.

Lori (10:58.597)
That sounds absolutely insane.

And this is awesome.

We Wine Whenever (11:04.103)
It's, it is insane.

We Wine Whenever (11:09.961)
But that's part of the problem. I mean, that's part of the problem. she did it. You know what? She did plead guilty. She took responsibility and accountability. She went to jail. She did her time and she got out on parole. That's what happened. So, you know, what she did, she took ownership for it. That's all she could do.

Lori (11:10.266)
Well,

Kelli (11:11.611)
Yeah.

Kelli (11:19.439)
Yeah. Yeah.

Kelli (11:32.401)
10 years? was she like, accessory of murder? Like, what was her, charge? Do we know? Like, I think 10 years is

Lori (11:39.929)
I don't know what our actual charge was.

We Wine Whenever (11:45.374)
I'll tell you what she took. Here it is. So she killed her mother on July 9th, 2015. June 9th, 2015. On June 14th, 2015, Gypsy wrote on Dee Dee's Facebook page, that bitch is dead, which immediately sparked concern from Dee Dee's friends. That's when they found that she was dead.

Kelli (11:45.637)
Like, what did that Robert Marshall go away for for hiring somebody?

Kelli (12:08.325)
That's f

Lori (12:10.15)
yes, there's things like that.

We Wine Whenever (12:15.613)
June 15th, Gypsy and Nicholas were taken into custody. And in July of 2016, Gypsy pled guilty to second degree murder and was sentenced to 10 years in prison. So she pled guilty to second degree murder, not first degree. So Nicholas Gojan went to trial November of 2018 and

Gypsy testified that she came up with the plan to kill her mother because it was the only way that she could escape her life of abuse. Gojan was found guilty of first degree murder in the death. So he went to trial. She took a plea.

Kelli (12:54.851)
I bet you he had a plea deal on the table that he should have taken instead of going to trial. Yep. Yep.

We Wine Whenever (12:58.606)
He should have taken, right? So she had a plea deal that she took. She had a public defender. It's not like, you know, she had this, you right, right. And she testified in his trial that it was her plan. So it's not like she didn't take accountability for it, you know?

Lori (13:00.005)
Probably.

Kelli (13:06.991)
Nobody was paying for some top -tier lawyer.

Kelli (13:16.751)
yeah, no, for sure. she was smart and took a plea deal and that poor kid probably didn't and got life in prison. that's it. he's gonna die in prison without parole.

We Wine Whenever (13:23.823)
without the possibility of parole.

Lori (13:24.119)
Now, and then there's an

Lori (13:29.189)
Right. And then, you know, there's the thing where there are, I believe, 17 stab wounds on her mother. And Nick, who has not told one lie about his whole whatever he had to do with it, he said he stabbed her four times. And then she says afterwards that he raped her. He says they had sex.

but all the animals were put back exactly where they were. Like, who gets raped and then puts all their stuffed animals back? It's just, there's just so many things that unfortunately I feel like she's...

Kelli (14:09.297)
I'm not going to lie when she said, cause she said an

Lori (14:16.217)
Get dark.

Kelli (14:19.371)
Now, I just feel like when she said, I told him I would let him rape me, that's what she said. I told him if he did this, I would let him rape me. that doesn't that's a that's a that's a what am I trying to say? But I don't want to be offensive to anyone who's dealt with any kind of sexual assault. You don't let somebody rape you. It's not even a thing. That's not even a thing.

We Wine Whenever (14:30.938)
Now.

We Wine Whenever (14:46.133)
No, he wanted to rape her mother and she said, no, you can't rape my mother.

Kelli (14:54.127)
You can, but you can rape me.

We Wine Whenever (14:57.517)
Because, yes, but it's not like she just said that. It was like, I'm gonna do this so that you don't rape my mother.

Kelli (14:57.787)
Right?

We Wine Whenever (15:08.151)
I don't know. mean, listen, the whole thing is screwed up.

Lori (15:08.463)
And then the next day, you're in a hotel room. How do you do that? And then the next day you're in a hotel room giggling, talking about how he's gonna, you're gonna have oral sex with him. He's gonna like make it happen for you. Like what? Deeply, deeply, deeply flawed and troubled person.

Kelli (15:21.341)
Right.

Kelli (15:25.583)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (15:27.628)
mean, there's definitely mental health issues.

Lori (15:31.225)
deeply flawed.

Kelli (15:32.505)
Yes. So the fact that she was denied therapy in jail is questionable and horrific.

Lori (15:37.849)
I don't, I don't, yeah, highly questionable.

We Wine Whenever (15:40.396)
But you can prove that. You can prove that. You can lie about it all you want, but it's certainly something that can be proved or disproved. And that's one of the things she wants to fight for, as far as prison reform goes. And then further on in the season of the Kardashians, we see Kim go to these prisons where there are certain prisons.

Kelli (15:44.496)
Yeah.

Kelli (15:51.396)
Yeah, I would imagine.

Lori (15:51.748)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (16:06.582)
where they are trying to rehabilitate them and they are getting them an education and they are, you know, working on their mental health, which is what needs to happen. Yeah, there are some people that can't be rehabilitated, but there are people that can. So, I mean.

Kelli (16:09.616)
Yeah.

Kelli (16:18.15)
Yeah.

Kelli (16:22.243)
Absolutely. Absolutely.

Lori (16:22.295)
I can, absolutely, yes. But I mean, this is a thing though.

We Wine Whenever (16:27.819)
So a little bit more of the timeline.

Lori (16:31.789)
is that maybe people would have a much better opinion about her if we heard about some of that. boy, here is her drama with this guy leaving that guy pregnant, not pregnant, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,

We Wine Whenever (16:32.907)
Go ahead.

Kelli (16:49.263)
Yeah.

Kelli (16:54.349)
Right.

Kelli (16:58.575)
I agree with that. I agree with that wholeheartedly.

Lori (17:02.543)
I mean...

We Wine Whenever (17:02.742)
Speaking of which, I looked up her net worth. Her net worth is $3 million since she's been out of jail. She's not even been out of jail a year.

Kelli (17:11.749)
And she says she just wanted to come out of jail and be a normal person and get a normal job. That's what she said. I think the minute, I know we're going to get there. I think the minute she got on social media, it was, it was over. It was over. And her, and her father said it.

Lori (17:16.269)
No, she did not and she never had any. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (17:17.234)
Mm

Lori (17:25.999)
Well really, quite frankly...

Lori (17:32.463)
There's like a weird delay. Her father, you know, she's actually hired a PR company.

Kelli (17:33.914)
No, go ahead.

Yeah.

Lori (17:44.333)
she's spending all this money on PR company. It's just if you really wanted to come out and live a nice quiet life.

Kelli (17:46.383)
Yeah, who does that? Right.

Lori (17:52.399)
Then why are you -

Kelli (17:53.297)
which you probably should have since you're on parole. I think your reality TV star dream could have waited one year when you were off parole. But her father said it, she's 30 years old and she's making decisions like a 17 and 18 year old would. But I mean, you go to prison for 10 years, that stunts your mental growth, obviously.

Lori (18:09.23)
Right.

Lori (18:14.158)
Absolutely.

We Wine Whenever (18:14.676)
And she never lived in the real world. She never lived in the real world. Absolutely. Absolutely. So I wanted to get a little bit back to the timeline. one of the ways her mother was able to do this in 2005, Hurricane Katrina came and they were down in Louisiana and they lost everything. So they went to this rescue shelter and her mom claimed that all their medical records and her birth certificate was lost and destroyed during the hurricane.

Kelli (18:16.559)
Right, right, she's always been imprisoned in one way or another.

We Wine Whenever (18:44.436)
So that's one of the ways, cause one of the things that Dee Dee did was she lied about her age. She had, you know, she had different date of births for her, different years, making her seem younger and younger so that she could continue to control her, which is insane. And then in 2008, she relocated to Springfield, Missouri, which at that point, I mean, her father's still in Louisiana. Now she's in Springfield, Missouri and she's, you know,

Kelli (18:49.669)
Yeah.

Kelli (18:57.583)
Yeah. So crazy.

We Wine Whenever (19:12.881)
she's become this like poster child for like the disabled. Like that's where they get the house, the habitat for humanity. They build her the house, they build her the ramp. You know, she's practically getting the key to the city, you know? And meanwhile, her mother is exploiting her and she's taking her to these doctors. She's holding her hand over her ears so she can't even hear what, you know, the mom is saying to the doctor. She's playing the game of sitting in the wheelchair.

Kelli (19:25.765)
Yeah, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (19:43.22)
And it's... Right.

Kelli (19:43.971)
knowing full well she can walk.

We Wine Whenever (19:49.298)
But knowing if she disobeyed her mom, she was gonna be abused. mean, you know, right, right. Horrible, horrible. And then I told you that the timeline is four. No, you haven't.

Kelli (19:51.501)
Mm -hmm. Chained to the bed for two weeks.

Lori (19:56.089)
Yeah. Horrible.

Kelli (19:58.49)
Yeah.

Kelli (20:02.513)
Although I'm not gonna lie, I thought about it with Joe.

Kelli (20:08.261)
I have it, I'm only kidding. Sorry, too soon, too soon.

We Wine Whenever (20:16.497)
So she goes to jail, right? So then she announced in April of 2019 that she was engaged to Ken, this guy, Ken. And then they broke up and then they got back together and then he broke up with her again.

Kelli (20:32.305)
Okay, so I saw the HBO Max thing that tells what happened with her mother, how she was raised and how she and this guy Nick orchestrated the death. Then I watched Life After Lockup. So then I fast forward to when she comes out of jail and she's with Ryan. I missed the Ken piece, except until the end of Life After Lockup where she does what we all knew she was gonna do. But...

We Wine Whenever (20:50.043)
Mm -hmm.

We Wine Whenever (20:56.73)
Right.

Kelli (21:00.653)
Why did he say he did they say why he was breaking up with her when he broke up with her?

We Wine Whenever (21:06.864)
So during the special where it was the confessional when she was in jail talking to them, she didn't know at the time why he was breaking up with her. She thought it was because he didn't like the spotlight because she was, know, gypsy Rose Blanchard and people were talking about her. But let's just make this known. The same way she met Ken is the same way that she met Ryan is they saw her special.

and they wrote to her and she responded to them. So he knew what he was getting into. It's not like he didn't know. But also what was revealed during that part, that special that you didn't watch, the confessionals, is there was a time where her mother wound up in the hospital. Her mother got really sick. I cannot remember what that was about. And she went to live with her grandfather and her step -grandmother. Well, at this point, she tells us that he was sexually assaulting her.

when she was seven or eight years old.

Kelli (22:06.107)
The grandfather who's in the Max special speaking? What a piece of shit.

We Wine Whenever (22:10.605)
Yes.

Lori (22:11.267)
Yes. And turns out that he probably did the same thing to Dee Dee.

We Wine Whenever (22:13.379)
Yes. And the producers ask him,

We Wine Whenever (22:19.991)
Right, right.

Kelli (22:22.907)
What a piece of shit.

We Wine Whenever (22:25.027)
Yep. And during the confessional story, the producers ask him, you know, they say that Gypsy has alleged that you molested her. And he says, no, that's not true. She wanted me to touch her and I told her that's not right. Yeah.

Lori (22:43.021)
Yeah, he said it was her.

Kelli (22:43.761)
my gosh.

We Wine Whenever (22:45.986)
Yep. Yep. He blamed an eight year old. Right. He blamed an eight year old. Yes. Yes.

Lori (22:46.223)
She was trying to touch him.

Kelli (22:52.966)
my gosh, that's disgusting.

Lori (22:59.769)
And then Wendy, wasn't there a thing where like

We Wine Whenever (22:59.936)
So the trauma that this girl has.

Lori (23:05.529)
Wasn't there a thing where,

He, Dee Dee also poisoned the, the, her stepmother.

We Wine Whenever (23:16.812)
Yes. So yes.

Lori (23:17.86)
Yeah, right?

Kelli (23:18.775)
I remember that was the Max thing. Yeah, because that bitch probably knew what he was doing.

We Wine Whenever (23:22.016)
That's yes, that's what the stepmother said that DD poisoned

We Wine Whenever (23:29.046)
Yeah, because honestly, he did it to her. He did it to her. And then the brother, Dee Dee's brother, they interviewed him for the confessional and he said, no, I don't think that that happened. I don't think that that happened. But I'm sure it happened. mean, I'm sure it happened. you know, listen, she never had a shot in life. She just didn't.

Kelli (23:32.923)
Mm -hmm. Right.

Kelli (23:52.431)
I'm sure it too.

We Wine Whenever (23:58.944)
You know, and it's sad that her mother's dead and I think she does regret it. But at this point, there's nothing she can do except for move forward. And, you know, maybe what needs to happen is, you know, kind of like we were talking about the housewives the other day. Like we are part of the problem because we are watching these shows. yeah, we are part of the problem.

Lori (24:19.962)
Right.

Kelli (24:20.293)
We are part of the problem. Vlash has called us out and she was right.

Lori (24:28.997)
But we're reporting on it because other, because it's popular with other people.

We Wine Whenever (24:30.283)
But I find it interesting. Yes. Yeah, no, I know.

Kelli (24:35.717)
Yeah, quite honestly, I had no idea. Like, I didn't know any of this. None of it.

We Wine Whenever (24:40.701)
No, I didn't either. I did not either.

Kelli (24:43.355)
Like I said, I probably knew about it when it was happening, but this stuff scares me.

Lori (24:51.845)
But she has had

We Wine Whenever (24:51.871)
So then more about the timeline.

We Wine Whenever (24:57.535)
Good.

Lori (24:58.031)
She has had an obsession with social media since she first got on it.

You know, so I think that that's always been her escape and maybe that's why she went right to it when she got out.

Kelli (25:08.399)
Yes.

Kelli (25:15.025)
I agree. think, but I think she kind of admit that like when she got out, like, I, you know, I, I put, I posted a video and all of a sudden I had like 3000 likes and all these followers and, and, listen, we all know social media can be addicting. We all know it. We, were Gen X. had none of this. So we're, we're

Lori (25:19.09)
yeah!

Kelli (25:41.265)
We can be responsible with it because we're adults and we have jobs and we have kids and we're running households, but our kids are addicted to social media, let's face it. They don't know any different and neither does she because she was in jail for 10 years.

Lori (25:55.737)
This is true.

We Wine Whenever (25:55.88)
Right, and prior to that she was in jail with her mother.

Lori (25:59.119)
with our mother.

Kelli (25:59.213)
Yeah, she didn't. I'm sure she didn't have, I mean, maybe, well, she had a computer, but yeah.

We Wine Whenever (26:03.634)
until her mother smashed it.

So then in August of 2022, she marries Ryan in jail. And December 28th, 2023, she has her early release from prison after serving her, it was actually eight and a half years.

Kelli (26:20.527)
Yeah, I was gonna say, would, cause she would just be getting out now.

We Wine Whenever (26:24.201)
Yes. So April of 2024, roughly three months after Gypsy was released from prison and she has officially filed from divorce from Ryan. So three months out of jail, living with Ryan and she files for divorce. And we see, you know, the end of the special that she's back with Ken and July of 2024, she announces that, you know, she's about to become her mother herself with Ken, Ken Urker.

and he had the name of the movie that the name of the show was mommy dead and dearest that he saw her in which is the same you know same place that ryan saw her and learned about her

Kelli (27:02.689)
So I saw...

I told you what I watched. then I saw some other special that was like episodes, but the earlier episodes were about when she was younger and her mom and then about her killing her mom. So I skipped over that stuff. I went to the end and I saw an episode where basically before she was marrying Ryan, her father and her stepmother, who I don't like, we're going to get to that. But, her father and her stepmother were asking her not to get married.

They did not want her to get married. Rightfully so. I totally agree with that. She reached out to Ken before she got married and was like, are you, do you not want me to get married? And he said, I don't think you should marry him. But he didn't say to her, I don't think you should marry him because I want to be with you. So, and Ryan knew all of that. So clearly they should not have gotten married. She's, she's.

We Wine Whenever (27:41.787)
Yeah. Yes.

We Wine Whenever (27:59.579)
Yes, he did.

Kelli (28:04.113)
basically talking to her ex fiance and asking him if she should marry you. You don't want to marry somebody like that. So I, cause I felt really bad for Ryan during the lifetime, lot, life after lockup. I did. I felt bad for him. I thought this poor, poor guy. But after watching that one episode of that other special, I was like, all right, he knew full well she was 100 % still in love with this Ken guy.

Lori (28:17.861)
NAAAA

We Wine Whenever (28:19.533)
No.

Kelli (28:33.329)
100%. But I did feel bad for Ryan though, like that one episode of the life after lockup where she's with her sister and she does say on national television that he basically, you know, could have impregnated her and she kind of gives more information than that, like TMI and he is a school teacher and he gets upset with her and rightfully so. But then I was thinking what her father said, like she's 30, but she has the mindset of a 17 year old.

Lori (29:04.653)
And she does have this thing with pregnant.

We Wine Whenever (29:04.954)
Yes, yes she does. She does.

Kelli (29:06.223)
You know? Yeah.

Mm -hmm.

Well, obviously, she's got mommy issues. Some people have daddy issues. She's got mommy issues. So she's going to prove to be the best mommy she can. But that baby could be Ryan's. Let's face it.

We Wine Whenever (29:26.607)
She says absolutely not. And what I also just saw recently, so in the state of Louisiana, where they are, if you are married and you are, cause she's still legally married, she's not divorced. She filed for divorce, but she's not divorced. The birth certificate has to have Anderson as the last name. Unless Ryan says, and by the way, there will be a paternity test also. Yes, there absolutely should be.

Kelli (29:53.573)
There should be. There should be. Because I swear I think this kid's Ryan's.

We Wine Whenever (29:58.396)
if ryan says if ryan says that she's you know he doesn't the baby doesn't have to have his last name that she can give it ken's last name but that's i i've never heard of a law like that

Kelli (30:00.005)
Wouldn't that be some shit?

Kelli (30:12.517)
Me neither.

We Wine Whenever (30:13.614)
I mean, I think that's kind of crazy.

Kelli (30:15.333)
Wait, because that's her last name?

We Wine Whenever (30:17.866)
Anderson is Ryan's last name. It's also her last name.

Kelli (30:20.39)
But it's her last name right now because the divorce isn't final. So that must be why.

We Wine Whenever (30:25.389)
Right.

I don't think that's why because I mean I know you know other pregnant women they just go with their maiden name for the child they don't even give it the you know

Kelli (30:38.555)
but that even though they're married and have a married last name.

We Wine Whenever (30:44.96)
I don't know, that's a good point. Maybe they aren't married. Yeah.

Kelli (30:46.501)
Like that's what I'm saying, the baby's name has to be Anderson because that's her legal name. But if they do a paternity test and it winds up being Ken's baby, then they should be able to give it Ken's last name. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (31:00.416)
I would think so. I don't know. I don't know. It's messy. It's just very messy.

Kelli (31:06.381)
It's very messy.

Lori (31:06.819)
Yeah, it's just totally messy. You're going from guy to guy to guy.

We Wine Whenever (31:09.739)
It is messy. why don't you like Christie?

Kelli (31:10.307)
It's very messy.

Lori (31:15.742)
please.

Kelli (31:16.111)
because she obviously reached out to Ken.

We Wine Whenever (31:20.384)
Well, she said she reached out to Ken.

Kelli (31:22.255)
Yeah, so what are you doing? She's married. Whether whether you think that's what she says, well, maybe listen, maybe, but she's married. Stay the fuck out of it. And she talks over everybody and she doesn't give anybody a chance to talk. And even her husband and her daughter on two separate occasions were like, you have to let me talk. You have to let me talk.

We Wine Whenever (31:26.07)
Well, actually, no, Ken reached out to her.

Lori (31:46.819)
And there's talk that.

Kelli (31:48.254)
She was very annoying, that woman.

We Wine Whenever (31:48.268)
Think.

Lori (31:51.503)
Yeah, there's talk that she was, you know, she was talking to a blogger while, you know, Gypsy Rose was still in jail. Like this whole lifetime thing, this is all set up way before she got out of jail. And, you know, her father is definitely a pushover and has a lot of guilt issues. But I think that the stepmother,

We Wine Whenever (31:54.763)
Go ahead.

Kelli (32:15.257)
Yes, yes.

Lori (32:16.313)
comes off like she's nice, but I think that she had a lot to do with the orchestration of Gypsy Rose's career after, did you, cashing in? Cashing in.

Kelli (32:29.969)
I totally agree with you. I think her father has her best interest at heart. I think her sister, I think her sister has her best interest at heart.

Lori (32:32.141)
And she has had fights.

We Wine Whenever (32:41.045)
I agree.

Kelli (32:41.253)
But that stepmother, I didn't know that about her talking to bloggers behind the scenes, but I totally believe it.

Lori (32:47.182)
in there.

And in 2019, they had a fight, her and Christy, because Christy was talking to a blogger and, you know, they cut ties for a while. Gypsy Rose cut ties for a while with Christy.

Kelli (33:09.999)
Well, when Ken broke up with Gypsy Rose, how the hell would anybody know if the stepmother wasn't talking to somebody? Or if Ken wasn't talking to somebody? Gypsy wasn't talking to anybody, she was in jail!

Lori (33:10.383)
So, you know.

We Wine Whenever (33:22.353)
she was talking in jail to these reporters. The lifetime people. Yes, they show it. They show you her on the phone. They show them her sitting in jail, them doing an interview with her in jail. Yeah, no, they were talking to her. They were.

Lori (33:24.55)
yeah, she was.

Kelli (33:28.771)
She was?

Lori (33:30.936)
Really?

Kelli (33:36.993)
you're right, you're right. I did see that. I did see that.

Lori (33:43.363)
And I think that this is something that Gypsy Rose is very used to. She went along with her mother's con. Now, if Christy is kind of the same way and controlling, you know.

Kelli (33:45.411)
mmm

Lori (33:58.793)
Maybe she's just going along with the fraud with Christie. Maybe they really don't get along. That's what's been put out there, that they really don't get along, like how they're showing. That, you know.

Kelli (34:00.431)
Which, clearly, she is.

Kelli (34:09.06)
Right.

Lori (34:12.899)
So I don't know.

Kelli (34:13.155)
I mean, listen, I'm happy that she stepped into that role for Gypsy because clearly she didn't have a normal mother. But I do see some manipulation there. I just don't like that she contacted Ken or was in contact with Ken, however it played out while Gypsy was married to Ryan, like let her like the father said, like I didn't agree with it. I didn't think it was the right thing for them. But I'm not going to tell her not to do it. Who the hell am I?

We Wine Whenever (34:19.246)
Mother, right.

Kelli (34:43.523)
So let them get married and work it out, you know, see what happens. That stepmother, I mean, we saw it on the camera. She said, Ken contacted me. That's all Gypsy had to hear. As soon as she said, he likes blondes, I'm a brunette. And then all of sudden we see her at the salon getting highlights. I mean, the writing was on the wall.

We Wine Whenever (35:02.619)
Yeah.

Lori (35:02.948)
YIP

We Wine Whenever (35:08.765)
But listen, these men are not innocent in this either. They knew what they were getting into. mean, Ryan is a special ed teacher. He's a special ed teacher. He, he of all people should know the trauma that Gypsy has been through in her life. You know? I mean,

Lori (35:12.781)
No!

Kelli (35:14.789)
They didn't. And what?

Lori (35:19.663)
Yeah, come on.

Kelli (35:21.008)
Yeah.

Kelli (35:27.695)
Yeah. And he knew that she was contacting her ex before they got married. Like that's a red flag, bro. Don't do it. Don't marry her because it's not going to end well for you.

Lori (35:28.709)
Well, keep an

We Wine Whenever (35:38.49)
He wasn't sure on the day of his wedding whether or not she was going to show up. And it was at the jail. He's like, I don't know if she's going to, you know, be there. I mean, obviously she's going to be there. He was questioning it.

Kelli (35:46.232)
Yeah. Yeah.

Lori (35:51.589)
But you know, keep in mind too.

We Wine Whenever (35:52.198)
So, you know, he knew what he was getting himself into.

Kelli (35:52.272)
Yeah.

Lori (35:56.099)
It's also a paycheck for him. I mean, I'm sure that he agreed to get married to her. I'm sure contracts were signed, you know, for her book, for her lifetime shit. you know, nobody's, I don't think anybody's as, you know, innocent as this whole narrative that's been put out there. I think it's a lot more involved than how it's been presented to everyone through...

Kelli (36:22.693)
I agree with you.

Lori (36:24.197)
Stitch specials and blu blu blu.

Kelli (36:26.384)
And I -

I think he proved it when the parole officer told her to shut down her social media and he was like, that's income.

We Wine Whenever (36:36.348)
Right, he did, 100%. Yeah.

Kelli (36:37.957)
He did. He proved it then.

Yeah.

Lori (36:41.689)
And I saw instances where I thought that he was very controlling.

We Wine Whenever (36:43.962)
or even when she got out of jail.

We Wine Whenever (36:48.953)
Yes. Yeah, even when she got out of jail and she wanted to go to the Chiefs game because of Taylor Swift. I mean, come on. Really?

Kelli (36:57.561)
Yeah. Well, somebody said it, I think it was her father and he was like, you know, her mother always got her these opportunities to meet people and get special treatment. you know, it could be that that's what she's looking for. Like she wants to meet Taylor Swift and she's gypsy Rose and she just got let out of jail. And chances are Taylor Swift is going to do her a solid a meter.

Lori (37:24.71)
Or look like a dick for not.

Kelli (37:25.669)
But thank God they put the kibosh on that.

And you know, I felt bad for her that first day she got out of jail and she was at her dad. Whose house were they at? Because then...

We Wine Whenever (37:36.344)
It was a rented, it was an Airbnb because she was still in the state of Missouri and nobody lived in Missouri.

Kelli (37:41.649)
Okay. Cause that wasn't, I thought that was her dad's house, but then they went, you know, then we were all of sudden we were in cutoff Louisiana. Okay. That makes sense. So, I lost my train of thought. Jesus Lord almighty. Every fucking time it happens.

We Wine Whenever (37:45.902)
Now.

We Wine Whenever (37:50.136)
Yeah. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (37:55.802)
you

Lori (37:57.912)
As you say.

We Wine Whenever (38:02.478)
Yes.

Kelli (38:02.564)
my God. All right, carry on.

Lori (38:04.217)
Well, I will tell you that I read that, I read that, this is horrible, but the mother's head was like almost severed off. Like this was, it just feels like it's been like packaged in this pretty bow. And I think that's, that's the problem that I have. And I have the problem, I have a problem with her kind of be like being seen as like this.

We Wine Whenever (38:06.158)
That's all right.

Lori (38:32.473)
girl boss like this success story after killing her mom. It's just, it's just cringy. There's just a cringe factor to it. For me.

We Wine Whenever (38:40.961)
Yeah.

Kelli (38:40.987)
Yeah, it looked pretty brutal. The scene looked pretty brutal. Tesla like happened to be in the room with me when I was watching that part and she was like, whoa. I'm like, yeah, this isn't, this is not.

We Wine Whenever (38:51.413)
Yeah, it did look brutal. She did say though that he had told her about his fantasies to kill other people and other situations that were very brutal.

Kelli (39:08.675)
I didn't hear that part. I mean, I don't doubt for a second that it's Nick. Yeah. It's probably, a, a, a good thing that that kid, you know, unfortunately is in jail because if he can do that, then he can, you know, obviously do it. I just remember what I was going to say. I felt so bad for her that day that they were at that Airbnb and they were telling her, no, you got to go here. No, you can stay here. No. And she was so scared.

Lori (39:09.46)
this Nick? yeah!

We Wine Whenever (39:13.461)
Yes. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (39:22.358)
Mm -hmm.

Kelli (39:37.499)
that they were going to send her back to prison, right? But now here she is on parole. She's still on parole and they're telling her to get off social media. She's not getting off social media. Like I saw this, this YouTube thing where she's not supposed to stay at Ken's house. She's staying at Ken's house. So now she's like, I think she's like feeling herself a little bit where she's kind of pushing it.

We Wine Whenever (39:40.032)
Mm -hmm.

Kelli (40:02.265)
So things have changed since that first day, because I felt so bad for her. I'm like this poor girl. Like she's so scared to go back to prison.

We Wine Whenever (40:10.719)
Well, Ken lives in Texas, so I guess he moved.

Kelli (40:14.949)
I think so. But she's still not like she's still living with her dad and stepmom.

We Wine Whenever (40:20.053)
Well, because she has to have a registered address if she's on probation. And because that was one of the things she was saying why she wanted to marry Ryan is because she has to register an address when she gets out and she wanted it to be where, you know, with him. She didn't want it to be with her dad, which, you know, why? You know?

Kelli (40:37.744)
with him.

Kelli (40:43.909)
Yeah. Yeah.

Lori (40:44.111)
We are live.

We Wine Whenever (40:48.245)
I don't know. I don't know. And now, and she's due January.

Lori (40:50.959)
Yeah, I must say I was not a Ryan fan.

Kelli (40:51.439)
and now she's pregnant.

Kelli (40:57.518)
No?

We Wine Whenever (41:00.135)
No, I wasn't either. I think he's creepy. I think everything about him is creepy. I think he's creepy.

Lori (41:00.663)
No, not Orion. Yeah, it's creepy.

He was like, pulling all at her and shit. Yeah, oof.

We Wine Whenever (41:08.403)
He gives me predator vibes. Yeah.

I don't like them.

Kelli (41:14.971)
Yeah, I wasn't a fan of the whole baby, baby, all baby.

Lori (41:19.437)
Yeah, ew, no, stop.

We Wine Whenever (41:20.546)
Yeah. No, I don't like it.

Kelli (41:24.069)
Right.

Lori (41:24.997)
So I saw a thing with him today, I think it was alive.

We Wine Whenever (41:25.16)
I think the only good that can come out of this is I do know that...

Lori (41:30.245)
I saw this thing with alive with him. Yeah, it was alive and he was saying how, he was flat out saying that Gypsy Rose cheated on him while they were married. I'm thinking, you know, with Ryan. So, I don't know. It's just so, so messy. I wish she would have just gotten out and just...

We Wine Whenever (41:32.69)
It was live.

Kelli (41:47.418)
for sure. She definitely did.

Kelli (41:56.337)
She definitely, she's on him with Ken.

We Wine Whenever (41:56.499)
because they are still married.

Lori (41:58.883)
Yeah. But I don't know. It's just weird. Like he's doing lives. It's just...

This is weird.

We Wine Whenever (42:06.321)
Right, why is he doing it? Right.

Kelli (42:07.889)
Well, he wants his 15 minutes too.

Lori (42:10.703)
Yeah, that's a thing.

We Wine Whenever (42:11.355)
and his paycheck.

Kelli (42:12.687)
Yeah. And honestly, I think that's what this guy Ken's in for too.

We Wine Whenever (42:14.362)
she

We Wine Whenever (42:19.709)
She did say that when her child is born, doesn't want the child in the media. She doesn't want the child on social media, that she's going to shield the child from that. So hopefully maybe that will get her off social media too. I don't know.

Kelli (42:27.675)
We'll see.

Lori (42:35.075)
Well, can I just say this?

Kelli (42:36.293)
I think she should just go live her life now.

Lori (42:40.741)
is she's paying a company, a PR firm, $7 ,500 a month, and online has been put what this PR recommendations are for her. And every single thing on there is talk about the baby, make posts about baby names, post this, post that. Don't do so many lives. Don't talk about the boyfriends, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Kelli (43:07.065)
And she is. She's doing it.

Lori (43:10.041)
But she's paying a PR firm. Come on.

That's.

We Wine Whenever (43:18.481)
Yeah.

Kelli (43:18.565)
And that's what she's doing. Cause I saw a YouTube of her talking about how she's going to have two nurseries, one at Ken's house and one at her house, because she can only be at Ken's house this many days a week and blah, blah, blah, blah. So she's already doing it. She's going to put that baby on social media and you know what? She's going to blow through her money.

Lori (43:24.356)
Mm

Lori (43:29.526)
and

and her attorney. yeah. Her attorney is now her manager. She's paying him $5 ,000 a month.

We Wine Whenever (43:43.845)
Wait, her attorney from her public defender, the public defender is now her manager?

Lori (43:44.325)
So that's $12 ,000 a month.

Lori (43:52.441)
Her attorney that she had when she got out of jail that was on that special is supposedly now her manager.

We Wine Whenever (43:59.643)
She, when she pled guilty. Yeah, that was her, that was her public defender.

Lori (44:05.241)
Yeah, now our manager.

We Wine Whenever (44:07.182)
come on, how does that happen?

Lori (44:08.547)
Yeah.

Kelli (44:09.457)
Because he wants his 15 minutes too!

Lori (44:12.495)
She wanted to get pregnant so she could have another season.

Kelli (44:13.667)
None of these people have her best interests at heart.

Kelli (44:20.497)
I believe that.

Listen, I feel bad for her. She got handed a raw deal, She got a bad hand. But that's what I mean. She's, I mean, I don't think she's, obviously she's not going to do what her mother did, but she could, she could do other damage in another way.

We Wine Whenever (44:31.003)
I feel bad for her baby now.

Lori (44:38.693)
How do you know?

How do you know? It's the perfect setup.

Lori (44:47.683)
It's what she knows.

Kelli (44:49.467)
Yeah, it is what she knows.

Lori (44:51.385)
That's a very difficult situation to do. that's what I'm saying.

We Wine Whenever (44:52.897)
It is what she knows. It's all she knows.

Lori (44:58.202)
You know?

Kelli (45:00.39)
now.

We Wine Whenever (45:01.357)
All right, so what's our takeaway? Our takeaway.

Lori (45:01.919)
And, our takeaway is...

Kelli (45:04.369)
Gypsy Rose needs to get off of social media and go live her life.

Lori (45:07.885)
Yeah, but I don't see it happening. just, I just see it. I don't see that happening. see her, I see this as like just a potential train wreck. Like that's all I can see for it. And I, that's horrible to say. I wish her well. I wish her all the best. But for me, there's just, the red flags are just flying, fluttering in the wind. And it's just, to me, it's just an absolute train.

We Wine Whenever (45:10.073)
What is it, Laura?

Kelli (45:32.048)
line.

Kelli (45:35.608)
low and in the wind.

Lori (45:38.511)
So there's

Kelli (45:39.162)
Agreed.

We Wine Whenever (45:40.427)
I agree too. So I guess let us know what other topics you guys want us to talk about besides Kelly and I do our housewives, but we like to do something that's non -housewives. So let us know what you guys want to hear about, like what interests you. We came up with Gypsy Rose Blanchard, but I did, I did. But I want to know what you guys want to hear.

Kelli (46:02.609)
That's just because Wendy fell down that rabbit hole.

We Wine Whenever (46:09.261)
Let us know. Put it in the comments. Send us a DM. We do respond to all of our DMs, so let us know. And by the way, if you could share us and subscribe to our podcast and YouTube, that'd be great.

Until next time, thank you for watching and listening to We Wine Whenever.

Kelli (46:28.625)
Bye.

We Wine Whenever (46:29.878)
Bye.