Luxury, Loyalty, and Ladybug Drama

RHONJ Season 1, Episodes 1 & 2

Episode 1: "Thicker Than Water"

The first episode introduces the central characters of The Real Housewives of New Jersey and their intricate relationships. Caroline, known for her strong family ties, emphasizes that her family is "thick as thieves." Dina, Caroline’s younger sister, is close with her, and both women are protective of each other. Teresa, who has been friends with Dina for 13 years, is a doting mother building her dream home. She’s known for her love of luxury, spending over $120,000 in cash on furniture while dismissing economic concerns.

Dina, who moved into Caroline’s house after a divorce, is an interior designer and event planner, married to Caroline’s brother-in-law, Tommy. Jacqueline, the outsider from Las Vegas, is married to Dina and Caroline’s brother, Chris, and is adjusting to life in Franklin Lakes. Danielle, a single mother with a controversial past, is introduced as a polarizing figure, having been engaged 19 times and now struggling financially.

The episode highlights the complex dynamics among the women, especially when Teresa and Jacqueline spy on Danielle during her blind date, which ends in disappointment when the man doesn’t show up. Caroline's son, Albie, graduates from Fordham University, and the Manzo family’s close-knit bond is on full display.

Episode 2: "Mama Knows Best"

In the second episode, Jacqueline navigates her relationship with her daughter, Ashley, who is struggling in school, while also planning her son CJ’s birthday party. Teresa continues her lavish lifestyle, shopping for matching outfits for the family and preparing for her daughter Gia’s audition for a movie role.

The tensions between Danielle and Dina are explored further as Danielle attempts to make amends with Dina at CJ’s birthday party, only for Dina to express her unease with Danielle’s obsessive behavior. Meanwhile, Caroline discusses her daughter Lauren’s future, and Jacqueline faces her own challenges with fertility, revealing her struggles with multiple miscarriages.

Dina’s philanthropic side is shown through her work with her foundation, Project Ladybug, as she prepares for a charity event. The episode ends with Danielle on a date with a much younger man, showcasing her attempt to navigate life as a single mother in the affluent world of Franklin Lakes.

Takeaways

• The hosts discuss their initial impressions of the Real Housewives of New Jersey cast members
• They comment on Teresa's physical appearance and her dream house
• They discuss Dina's move to New Jersey and her strained relationship with Caroline
• The hosts share their reasons for watching the show Danielle's behavior raises concerns among the other women
• Teresa's parenting style is criticized
• Ashley's schoolwork becomes a topic of discussion
• Teresa's house construction is shown
• CJ's birthday party is a lavish event Danielle's desperate need to fit in with the group leads to her coming on too strong and causing conflicts.
• Teresa's explosive behavior, like flipping a table, is a result of her insecurities and fear of abandonment.
• The Manzo family's lack of empathy towards Danielle may be due to her overwhelming and off-putting behavior.
• Jackie's struggles with fertility and fear of miscarriages highlight the emotional toll it takes on individuals and their relationships.
• Dina's questionable behavior, like hiring a family friend as her assistant and discussing inappropriate topics during a high-end dinner, showcases her lack of professionalism.

Transcript

We Wine Whenever (00:00.175)
Hi, welcome to We Why Whenever. I'm Wendy.

Kelli (00:03.694)
I'm Kelly.

Lori (00:04.733)
And I'm Lori.

We Wine Whenever (00:06.712)
Today we are recapping Real Housewives of New Jersey, season one, episodes one and two. We're bringing it way back since we finished the finale and our recap of The House Husbands. We're gonna go back to the beginning of New Jersey, where it all started. So I would.

Kelli (00:24.987)
Yeah, it's hard to watch it knowing everything we know now and like it's hard to not have a biased opinion already, but we shall do our best.

We Wine Whenever (00:33.592)
I tried to watch it with new lenses on, like as I did when I first saw it and remember what it is I liked about it. So when it first starts, we start out with Caroline and her talking about her being thick as thieves. And the cast members in this season are Dina, Teresa, Caroline, Jacqueline, and Danielle.

Kelli (00:43.525)
Right.

Kelli (00:58.993)
Danielle Stout.

We Wine Whenever (01:00.27)
Danielle Stalb, that's right. And we start out with finding that Teresa grew up in New Jersey with the big hair and she was a Jersey girl and that she has known Dina for 13 years. I was surprised. I didn't realize that they knew each other that long.

Kelli (01:16.015)
No, I think they met each other when Teresa was working at a department store in the makeup department or something. I think.

We Wine Whenever (01:24.449)
Yeah, think we find that out later on, but I don't know that it was ever even mentioned on the show. Laura, do you remember that being mentioned? Because I know you rewatched the whole first season.

Kelli (01:30.107)
Okay.

Lori (01:38.204)
No, I don't recall anything about that, about how they met, no.

We Wine Whenever (01:44.972)
When we meet Caroline, Theresa calls her the mama of the group. because Caroline is Dina's older sister, we find out that, yes, there's 11 years difference and Jacqueline is their sister -in -law because she's married to their brother, Chris. So it is all family. I mean, it did start out to be family. I mean, obviously, Theresa wasn't family.

Kelli (01:57.671)
11 years difference.

Lori (02:13.61)
It was pretty wild how Caroline and Dina, how many brothers and sisters they had. That's a big family. I think it was like 10 or 11.

Kelli (02:20.711)
Yeah, I think there are 11. And there's 11 years difference. And Caroline's the oldest and Dina's the youngest. So her mom had a baby every year?

We Wine Whenever (02:20.744)
yeah.

11 and Dean is the youngest.

Lori (02:25.054)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (02:31.921)
Mm. That's what they did back then.

Lori (02:33.266)
Ow.

Kelli (02:34.577)
Which I was right!

Lori (02:36.584)
Ow.

We Wine Whenever (02:38.101)
That's what they did back then, right? So Caroline likes Teresa at this point. We see them shopping together. And I will be honest, Teresa with just having three kids, she did have a bang in body. She was in good shape. She was in really good shape. And listen, I give her that. It was surprising for me to see her, because I really, it has been so long since I've watched.

Kelli (02:38.929)
Damn.

Lori (02:40.554)
Mm -hmm.

Kelli (02:54.646)
hell yeah. yeah. Yeah.

Lori (02:58.633)
Almost definitely.

We Wine Whenever (03:07.538)
watched it back then, but I liked Teresa when she first came on. She was my form of comic relief too, which is what Caroline called her. Listen, the reason I watched these shows was I watched them for mindless entertainment. You know, just to forget about what's going on in my own life and watch, you know, watch somebody else's for once. And I like to laugh.

Kelli (03:14.342)
Yeah.

Kelli (03:20.347)
Of course.

Kelli (03:26.011)
especially watching people with like opulent lifestyles, which is what the housewives started at as you know, I mean

Lori (03:34.184)
And you know, you watch it because it's a fucking train wreck. It's a train wreck.

Kelli (03:39.845)
It didn't start out that way though.

We Wine Whenever (03:40.966)
No, it didn't, it didn't.

Lori (03:42.553)
No, but you know, all of them turn out to be a train wreck. All the housewives show. Yeah.

Kelli (03:47.141)
Yeah, now, but...

We Wine Whenever (03:48.657)
Yeah, it didn't. That's not why I started watching them. didn't, I watched it because I liked to see the houses, the clothing. I like to laugh. I like to, I like to, I like to laugh with them or at them, but I like to laugh.

Kelli (03:51.269)
No, me neither.

Kelli (03:57.606)
Yeah.

Kelli (04:01.903)
Yeah, and Jersey was just so appealing because and I watched all the other ones before it, know, OC, New York, Atlanta, but New Jersey was just appealing because that's where we're from. You know, and they didn't start going down the shore until after, like after a couple of seasons.

We Wine Whenever (04:18.768)
No, it was a while. And then we see Teresa's dream house that she's been building for three years. because she doesn't like to live in, she didn't want to look at other people's houses because that skeaves her. That is one line I have never forgotten. I remember her saying that. Other people's, yeah. Yeah, because it's a horrible thing to say. mean, yeah, like.

Kelli (04:39.759)
And she got a heap about that at the reunion from Andy.

Terrible thing to say.

We Wine Whenever (04:49.379)
I don't know.

Lori (04:51.496)
Well, the best is.

Kelli (04:51.791)
Especially now that we saw where she used to live. Sorry, Lor, go ahead.

We Wine Whenever (04:54.661)
Yeah.

Lori (04:55.464)
Okay, well the best is now is that she's been to prison. So how dirty is that?

Kelli (05:00.687)
Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

Lori (05:02.128)
So I thought about that when I heard her say, you know, I don't want to live in a house that someone else has lived in. That's gross. I thought to myself, well, wonder how you'd like that toilet at the jail.

We Wine Whenever (05:02.557)
Yeah.

Kelli (05:14.105)
Exactly. And if you didn't build that big old house and take out fake mortgages, you wouldn't have went to prison. If you did just buy somebody else's house, you wouldn't have had to go, probably.

Lori (05:19.806)
There you go.

Lori (05:24.66)
There you go.

We Wine Whenever (05:24.775)
Listen, back then, again, I was rooting for her. I didn't dislike her. I did like her. mean, we see her go furniture shopping and pay $120 ,360 because she hears the economy is crashing. That's why she pays in cash. I mean, listen, she is no scholar. We know that.

Kelli (05:32.293)
Yeah, no, I didn't dislike her.

Kelli (05:48.889)
Now. Now.

Lori (05:49.873)
No.

No, you know what that was? That was like IRS come and get me. I thought to myself, what are you kidding me? Who does that? I mean, it's okay. All right. You want to do it. You got the cash. You want to do it. All right. Don't do it on TV. What are you doing? What are you doing? And for me, it was very interesting because I'm going back and watching it. I hadn't watched it from the beginning. So these Housewives shows aren't my gig, but

Kelli (05:52.976)
Now.

Kelli (05:59.334)
Yep.

Kelli (06:06.223)
Exactly. Yep.

We Wine Whenever (06:08.334)
Exactly.

Lori (06:22.674)
So it was interesting to watch it, but know what was gonna happen further down the line. So like you could see the writing on the wall clear as day.

Kelli (06:32.87)
Yes.

Lori (06:34.524)
in regards to the trouble with Joe Giudice was gonna be in with his business and his money and the whole.

Kelli (06:46.0)
Yes.

Lori (06:46.11)
You could just see it. Whereas if you were watching it from the beginning and you hadn't watched, you know what I mean? You wouldn't see that.

Kelli (06:52.773)
No, you just thought they had it like that. You know, like the opening scene of when they show Chris and Jacqueline Lurita's house and they have all their black cars lined up. Did you see that? So when we used to go to the family reunions at my cousin Rosie's house up there, and we learned from Gina, she did a sizzle reel for the show. I never even knew that. I knew she knew them and I knew she went to the Pescual Salon, but I didn't know she did a sizzle reel. But when we used to go to the family reunions, they had all white cars.

We Wine Whenever (06:54.934)
Right, right, right.

We Wine Whenever (07:03.203)
Right. Yeah.

Lori (07:04.468)
Mm -hmm.

We Wine Whenever (07:14.178)
Mm

Kelli (07:20.997)
that's exactly how it was in their driveway. Their white cars were all lined up. Lamborghini, Porsche. It was so funny. Yes, yeah, and and they got it like that. So back in the day, you just thought Teresa had it like that. Which she didn't.

We Wine Whenever (07:28.888)
Must be nice.

We Wine Whenever (07:36.108)
Right, right. And everything in her new house, her dream house was marble, granite, and onyx. And like, you know, Dina said, like, do you want to live in a banquet facility or like a house? Like, it's just so opulent. It's, it really was over the top.

Kelli (07:51.207)
Too much, too much, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (07:55.395)
it wasn't, it was not, it was never homey. It wasn't.

Kelli (07:55.663)
It wasn't homey.

Kelli (07:59.694)
No. That one room, the family room. Yes, very sterile, yes.

Lori (08:00.97)
It was very sterile.

We Wine Whenever (08:06.593)
Yeah. And then we learn a little bit about Dina, how she moved in with her sister Caroline after her divorce and her and her daughter, Lexi, and that the people in the town didn't really like her because they thought she was a gold digger. I mean, I don't know.

Lori (08:24.734)
Nope. Didn't I see or read a thing that

Dina and Caroline married brothers?

We Wine Whenever (08:34.144)
Yeah, they talk about that in the first episode. Yeah.

Kelli (08:34.203)
Mm -hmm.

Lori (08:36.68)
Yeah.

Kelli (08:37.927)
Caroline's been married to Al Manzo, which I forgot how big he was when the show first came on, for 30 -something years. He has a brother, Tommy, who he runs the brownstone with because their father ran it before that. He married Dina after her divorce from her first husband, Lexi's dad. He's the one that just got found guilty for hiring a mobster to beat up Dina's current

We Wine Whenever (08:43.17)
Yeah.

Kelli (09:07.387)
Husband, he was found guilty. Yes.

Lori (09:08.798)
Really? This didn't come out.

We Wine Whenever (09:10.657)
and breaking in and tying them up. Like Dina was there and witnessed it.

Kelli (09:19.867)
He hired somebody to do that, he didn't do it himself.

Lori (09:20.111)
my.

We Wine Whenever (09:22.444)
Right.

Kelli (09:25.125)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (09:26.047)
I mean, the interesting thing is, and again, I don't like to look at this, all that Caroline, how they were talking about family, family, and that they always have each other's backs and, you know, even Jacqueline, they don't even like, Dina and Caroline don't even talk anymore.

Kelli (09:43.833)
And Dina says it in the first episode. It's nice to know my sister's got my back no matter what. She even says it. And she did. She did.

We Wine Whenever (09:48.213)
Yeah, I know. I know, I wrote it down. I'm like, it's sad. It is sad. It's sad to where they're at today because again, that was something I was rooting for too. I was rooting for that family. It was enjoyable watching them. Although I didn't like Dina. No.

Kelli (10:01.783)
Yes. And I'm not a big fan of Dina. always liked Caroline. Caroline was my favorite. She always reminded me of my mother. That's how my mother is. But in Dina's defense for not speaking to Caroline, Caroline and Dolores both wrote character reference letters on behalf of Tommy Manzo, who was just found guilty. They wrote character reference letters on his behalf to try to get him out of trouble.

Lori (10:32.048)
I read a thing here. Someone was saying that Dina's marriage to her husband was a business arrangement and that Tommy agreed to marry Dina on camera for VH1's My Big Fat Fabulous Wedding to help launch her reality TV career. For Al and Tommy, the brownstone would prominently...

be featured as the event facility for the wedding, which would lead to an increase in bookings. So their motivation was to boost revenue for the family business. And the VH1 wedding specialist tape 2005, 2006 aired in 2007, which was the same year Dina signed her Bravo contract for Housewives New Jersey. So it did launch her career.

Kelli (11:04.571)
I believe it.

Kelli (11:23.207)
totally believe it. I totally believe that that was an arranged marriage for...

Lori (11:24.614)
And then... Yeah. The casting story is that Dina and Jacqueline were chosen for the original cast. Then Dina recruited Teresa and then Jacqueline suggested two other mutual friends. Then when the two other friends dropped out, Jacqueline suggested... Caroline and production found Danielle Staab when they were at that Chateau Salon in Franklin Lakes.

Kelli (11:45.073)
Caroline or Danielle.

We Wine Whenever (11:55.358)
Well, Danielle was friends with Jacqueline though. I think they really were friends before.

Kelli (12:01.403)
I think that when Danielle got the opportunity to be on the show and found out who else was going to be on the show, that's when she befriended Jacqueline and tried to befriend it. Dina and Dina saw right through her craziness. But Jack. Yeah, I think that the show came first and the friendship came after. I don't think they had a longstanding friendship prior to being recruited for the show.

We Wine Whenever (12:16.996)
that could be.

We Wine Whenever (12:23.409)
That could be.

We Wine Whenever (12:27.589)
Okay, I mean, I believe that. believe that. You know, Caroline says that she lives for her children and her husband and her career is secondary. I mean, at that point, she didn't really have much of a career.

Lori (12:27.814)
Mm.

Kelli (12:41.561)
not to be rude because I do love Caroline but I thought the same thing did she even have a career because she never mentioned it.

We Wine Whenever (12:49.597)
No, don't, yeah. I don't know that she did, to be honest with you. I think it was her family, which is fine. That's fine. It's fine. I did forget how funny Christopher was and how much I really liked Christopher and Albie and Lauren. I really like them. I really do, especially Christopher. Some of the things that Christopher says, like Caroline said, he's like, she never knows what's gonna come out of his mouth and he makes her laugh all the time.

Kelli (12:56.955)
Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Kelli (13:14.833)
Yeah.

I enjoy her kids. I enjoy watching her kids. Not so much Lauren. I just think that Lauren, well, I think it happens in later seasons, but I just think she's she was kind of like a spoiled little brat.

We Wine Whenever (13:18.853)
I do too.

We Wine Whenever (13:32.092)
Well, she's daddy's girl. I mean, we see that in the very beginning. She's daddy's girl, you know? And she's the only girl, you know? She's a daddy's girl. And that's, you know, listen, her parents have all this money, so I don't think it's a problem. I don't.

Kelli (13:35.833)
Yeah. Yeah.

Kelli (13:42.874)
Yeah.

Lori (13:52.254)
She doesn't seem like she's a bad person.

We Wine Whenever (13:55.021)
No, no, she's not. She's not.

Kelli (13:55.833)
No, no, no, no. But I just enjoy watching the brothers more. They're more comical.

Lori (13:57.95)
Not like that.

We Wine Whenever (14:00.793)
Yeah. I mean, Christopher even says about Albie, he's like, Al is actually that good looking. It's not like it's the camera. I just think that's hysterical because it's true. I mean, his brother is very good looking and it's obvious that Chris isn't, but he is so funny. He's got such a good personality. I mean, even at one point. that's awesome. That's awesome. I mean, you know, he says he wants to be the face of strip clubs and car washes.

Lori (14:00.936)
Yeah.

But that.

Kelli (14:11.505)
That was funny.

Very good looking.

Kelli (14:20.133)
Yeah, Albie and his wife are having a baby.

We Wine Whenever (14:29.814)
And his mom's like, all right, well just make me proud. Like, don't do it trashy, you know?

Kelli (14:32.479)
Yeah, she and I love I have that like she's justifying like that that there are high end strip clubs like scores like scores

We Wine Whenever (14:38.968)
Yeah. Yeah. Why not? Listen. Exactly. Exactly. And then at one point where, was it in this episode or the next episode? No, I think it's in the next episode. Yeah. I won't get to it. It's in the next episode.

We Wine Whenever (14:57.44)
well, Carolyn also says that her kids are street smart people. You can go further with street smarts than you can with book smarts. I think she says that because, yeah, I think she says that because Albie is the only one who went to college. The other two didn't, you know, they didn't want to pursue. And that's fine. Like not everyone has to go to college. It's not for everyone.

Kelli (15:06.383)
Well, I don't know about financially, but...

Kelli (15:17.158)
Yeah.

Kelli (15:20.807)
Hal B's college graduation party was in the first episode, right? Yeah. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (15:23.841)
Yes, yes. And you know, we see Caroline running around helping everybody get dressed, helping Lauren pick out her shoes, finding this one's tie, tying this one's tie. Yet again, that's why I relate to her because that's me in my house. like, you know, I got a million things going on. you know, hostessing the party and yet I'm still running around trying to get everyone ready to go. So that's what I like. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.

Kelli (15:39.333)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Lori (15:49.194)
That's the way of a mom.

Kelli (15:51.257)
Yeah, yeah, in our lives for sure.

We Wine Whenever (15:57.09)
So then we see.

Dina's doing, she is a interior designer and that's also parlayed into event planning because she has an office at the Brownstone where she does that. So Caroline's kids work at the Brownstone as well. Lauren at this part in the very beginning is handling the brides for the weddings. And Christopher, yep, she's a bride bitch. And Christopher, I guess, is handling the valet.

Kelli (16:21.777)
She's the bride bitch.

We Wine Whenever (16:28.747)
I mean, I think Albie at this point is just coming in and out because he was going to school.

Kelli (16:34.875)
Well, he was waiting to get into law school at this point.

We Wine Whenever (16:37.833)
Yeah, and then I think he never got into law school, right?

Kelli (16:41.275)
He got in, we'll see it in later episodes, he got in, but he has a learning disability and they basically told him, I think he was going to Fordham and they basically told him like, this isn't for you. You could try a different law school, but this isn't for you.

Lori (16:55.218)
Well, he put on an academic probation because he didn't do well enough on certain classes. And then they said, we don't think you have a future in this. But then he went to an attorney and the attorney said, well, you did tell them that you have a problem.

Kelli (17:01.884)
Yeah.

Kelli (17:17.435)
A learning disability, yeah.

Lori (17:18.798)
a disability and they gave you a phone number for assistance and you called that. He said he called that number and he couldn't get it through to anybody. And then he subsequently ended up like failing, failing a class, but just by like two points or something. And that's how that whole thing.

Kelli (17:38.022)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (17:40.373)
That's too bad.

Kelli (17:42.043)
Then think you try the State Police Academy. I guess we'll get there. Yeah.

Lori (17:44.36)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (17:44.745)
Really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right, so then we see a little bit about Jacqueline. She is from Vegas. She moved from Vegas because that's where she met her husband and he lives in New Jersey. And Franklin Lakes is totally different from what she was used to. That was the thing I thought was interesting about this first episode.

One, the emphasis on Franklin Lakes. Literally, the town is a character in this. It is. But she never...

Kelli (18:15.013)
Yes.

Kelli (18:18.735)
Yeah, except Danielle lives in Wayne and Teresa wasn't in Franklin Lakes either.

We Wine Whenever (18:26.399)
But they all keep talking about Franklin Lakes. Okay. And where is the brownstone? That's not in Franklin Lakes, right? Patterson.

Kelli (18:29.157)
Yeah, and that's where Chateau is.

Kelli (18:37.031)
other sin.

Lori (18:38.633)
Add

We Wine Whenever (18:41.205)
So she also didn't feel welcomed. Like she didn't know anybody. She knew Caroline and she knew Dina and she didn't really have any friends when she moved from Las Vegas. Yeah, I can't imagine. And she was a single mom because she had Ashley when she was really young. Ashley's 17 at this point and her son CJ is six and she's gonna be having his birthday party.

Lori (18:41.811)
Yeah.

Kelli (18:55.409)
That had to be hard, huh?

We Wine Whenever (19:12.116)
We learn about a little bit about Danielle, that she's 45 and she's not the hottest, but she's confident in her looks.

Kelli (19:24.133)
You know, I don't remember feeling as bad for Danielle's daughters as I did watching rewatching this. Like, I don't know, because I was younger and my kids were so little. Joe might not have even been born by the time this came. no, probably because. But I feel so bad for those girls. Where the fuck was their father? Like, honestly, the first Daniel's first scene, she's like, so why do you think people get divorced? Like.

We Wine Whenever (19:31.165)
Mm -hmm.

We Wine Whenever (19:34.802)
Mm -hmm.

We Wine Whenever (19:52.626)
I know.

Kelli (19:53.679)
What? What are you doing?

We Wine Whenever (19:55.975)
I know, I know.

Lori (19:58.558)
Yes, she is not getting Mother of the Year award.

Kelli (20:01.975)
No, but she thinks she is. That's the crazy part. Like she thinks being so open and honest with her kids makes her mother of the year. It's like to an extent, yes, but not with that.

Lori (20:03.528)
No. yeah.

Lori (20:10.301)
No.

Lori (20:13.864)
No.

We Wine Whenever (20:14.482)
I mean, she even says, which I find ironic and funny, either love her or you hate her. I pretty much think it's, and I don't like to use the word hate, but I don't know anyone that actually loves her. don't know that anyone, I don't, I don't remember anyone being Team Danielle, do you?

Kelli (20:30.754)
No. No.

Lori (20:31.881)
No. She's a very, very troubled, troubled woman. And what happens is, is that hurt people hurt other people. And she just makes it impossible for anybody to love her because she doesn't feel like she's deserving of love. So she just continuously like fucks herself. And that's what I saw when I watched the show. I was like, you're a mess.

Kelli (20:46.982)
Yes.

Kelli (20:53.861)
Yeah. So she...was she adopted?

Lori (21:00.562)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (21:01.237)
I don't, how do you know that?

Kelli (21:02.479)
Yeah, because at one point she, I think it's season two, she looks for her biological mom.

Lori (21:06.686)
Yeah, yeah, I'm on season two. yeah.

We Wine Whenever (21:08.24)
Okay. didn't, I didn't see, I don't remember that, but I do know that she had mentioned in the very first scene that we're learning about her, that she'd been engaged 19 times was a model at Ford modeling and the first person in the state of New Jersey to get a black AmEx even before Madonna. How does she know when Madonna got her black AmEx? Are you kidding me?

Lori (21:27.626)
Yeah, okay.

Kelli (21:31.303)
find it very hard to believe. Although if she if she was 45 this must have come out in like 2009 45 and 2009 where it's a 15 so she's 60 Danielle. How old's Madonna?

We Wine Whenever (21:46.48)
Madonna's older than 60. She's Madonna.

Lori (21:47.356)
It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. She's not in any way, shape, or form in the realm of Madonna world. So no.

Kelli (21:50.833)
That's what I'm saying. There's no way.

Kelli (21:55.716)
Right, that's impossible that she had her black bar before Madonna.

We Wine Whenever (21:58.98)
Well, she was talking, I think she was, it wasn't her, it was her husband because she never had to worry about finances and she could have whatever she wanted because of her husband's wealth. So I don't know what he did. don't honestly, I don't even care because I just, you know, I think she's not a good person.

Kelli (22:03.601)
Right.

Kelli (22:10.544)
Right.

Lori (22:17.258)
I saw this, no, I saw this interview thing with her and this is what she had to say. I don't have to try hard to get attention. Ergo, I was engaged 21 times. It's no accident. And 19 of those were before I had children. Why? No one has asked me. It came from me wanting to punish people that were abusing me.

But the way I got them to ask me to marry them quickly is I said I was a virgin and I would not have sex until I was married. That will get a ring on your finger really quick. You can't do that once you have kids.

Kelli (23:02.928)
She said that?

Lori (23:04.362)
She said it. I watched her say it. So I thought to myself, who were these fucking 19 people? You had 19 people, guys abusing you to the point that you would get them to ask you to marry them and then dump them? Because basically that's what she's saying. It's crazy town.

Kelli (23:24.731)
can't believe it's been this long and I've never heard that. I've done my research, people.

Lori (23:28.958)
Yep, I saw it. watched her say it. There was a little interview thing. It was crazy. Yeah. I wrote it down verbatim, word for word, she said, because I couldn't even believe what she was saying when she was saying it. I was like, you gotta be fucking kidding me.

We Wine Whenever (23:29.11)
never heard that either.

Kelli (23:34.711)
I believe you. I just can't believe I've never heard it before

Kelli (23:45.457)
That's Looney Tunes!

Lori (23:46.952)
and Looney Tone!

We Wine Whenever (23:46.977)
That is Looney Tunes. That is Looney Tunes. So Jacqueline says that the way she met Danielle was at that Chateau hair salon. And within three hours of knowing her, she pretty much told her her whole life, which I can definitely, right. Which I could definitely see Danielle doing that because she just puts it all out there thinking that she's got something great to tell. Then we see Lexi and

Kelli (24:02.469)
more than Jacqueline wanted to know.

We Wine Whenever (24:17.098)
talking to her mom and how it's, know, Franklin Lakes is a very affluent town. And Lexi says this, if I had a fat old mom, I would hate it. What? Lexi.

Kelli (24:27.853)
she got a lot of... Dina got some heat from that on the reunion as well.

We Wine Whenever (24:33.418)
Yeah, I mean, I couldn't believe that she said that. was like, boy, okay. I mean, and Lexi, yeah, she was little and she turned out to be a beautiful young lady. She really did. Yeah, she really did. Then we see Teresa with her girls and she's taking pictures of them outside before they go into Gia's rehearsal for her, whatever she's doing, her dance rehearsal.

Kelli (24:38.767)
Yeah, I mean she was a little girl, but still yikes

Mmm very much so very much so

Kelli (25:02.267)
My favorite thing is that Melania will be acting like a complete animal and Teresa will say, Melania do fabulous. And she stops. She stops acting like an animal. She puts her hands out and goes fabulous. Melania really was a sixth housewife for sure at that time.

We Wine Whenever (25:10.475)
Hahaha!

We Wine Whenever (25:22.719)
Hahaha!

Lori (25:26.472)
Yeah, those kids were like, whoa. Whoa.

Kelli (25:29.371)
Well, when they were in that boutique and they're at the cash register, like...

We Wine Whenever (25:31.572)
my god.

Lori (25:32.691)
No.

We Wine Whenever (25:34.837)
couldn't believe them in that boutique. And when she walked in, she says to the store owner, do you remember me? I mean, if you had been in there one time, she certainly would remember you with these animals. Like, are you kidding me?

Kelli (25:41.617)
Yeah, just like

Yeah

Kelli (25:49.637)
And that is no shade because Joe was a hot mess when he was little in a store. So I get it.

We Wine Whenever (25:54.805)
Hahaha!

But she had no, she like, had no awareness really of even what was going on. Like they were running the show. They're running around saying, I want this, I want this. Instead of like, you know, trying to rein them in, she was just doing whatever they asked her to do. I was like, poor. No.

Kelli (26:13.157)
No, there was none of that. Right.

Lori (26:17.598)
The bulb is not bright.

Kelli (26:21.327)
I think at that point, think about her kids ages. Like Melania was two. I don't know how old Gia and Gabriella were, but they weren't that much old. I mean, you know.

We Wine Whenever (26:27.773)
Yeah. I think, I think like, I think Gabriella, I think Gia was seven. So Gabriella was probably five.

Kelli (26:35.173)
Yeah, so we'll cook.

Yeah. I mean, that's, you know, I'd be probably laying in the fetal position in the corner of the room at that point. Like, just put me out of my misery, man.

We Wine Whenever (26:43.528)
Mm -hmm.

We Wine Whenever (26:52.871)
Listen, as a mom of three that, I had boys though, a mom of three that all my kids were two years apart. So I would go out with them at two, four and six or, you know, four, six and eight. Sorry, my brain stopped there for minute. So I know like how it can be, but I can just tell you that that would have never happened.

Kelli (27:19.697)
No.

We Wine Whenever (27:20.589)
It would have never happened. It wouldn't have. It wouldn't. Yeah, like we wouldn't allow that to happen.

Kelli (27:23.373)
No, I would have kicked Joe's ass and put him in the car and gotten him out of there. No. No.

We Wine Whenever (27:32.144)
Whether there was a camera there or not, that wouldn't have happened.

Kelli (27:36.935)
Correct.

Lori (27:37.15)
And certainly not with the camera there. yeah.

We Wine Whenever (27:39.016)
Exactly.

Kelli (27:40.315)
I think maybe that's why she was the way she was in that story because she was on camera.

We Wine Whenever (27:46.598)
No, I think that's how she is. think those kids have always controlled her. just wants to make her kids happy and give them whatever they want. She doesn't know how to say no.

Kelli (27:50.855)
She's just very passive as a parent.

Yeah. Listen, I will say this. I think that Teresa has always, don't, I think at this point, right now, present day, I think that she puts her daughters in positions that she shouldn't as a parent for the show. But I do think that Teresa loves her daughters.

more than anything in the world and will do anything she can to protect them and take care of them. But I also do think that she makes decisions that, you know, aren't the best for them. And it's because she wants to hold on to fame.

We Wine Whenever (28:40.922)
Yeah, I agree with that. I agree.

Lori (28:41.043)
Well, when I'm

When I watch the show, and like I said, I'm watching it from somebody who's seen future episodes already and not watched the back episodes, but when I watch it, it's almost like she's such a product of Bravo. she's only, this is all she's ever known. And she's not the brightest bulb to begin with. She seems like a nice person, a bit crazy, but...

Kelli (29:03.388)
Yes.

Kelli (29:09.585)
Right.

Lori (29:13.864)
This is all she, it's all she knows. So I think that's why she operates the way she does, because she just doesn't know any better. Like she just thinks that this is normal. All this drama and goings on and backstabbing and manipulation, because that's, that's been her job. So she knows.

Kelli (29:21.293)
so influenced by

Kelli (29:34.406)
And Bravo has encouraged her to be that person. It's just like Brandi Glanville. They have encouraged her to be this person. They have. I mean, I honestly think Teresa and Joe Gorgor can blame Bravo for the fact that they just, it's, they fucking tore their family apart. Bravo. Production. Yes. Yes, her ratings. But they allowed it.

Lori (29:37.578)
Absolutely.

Lori (29:53.956)
Mm -hmm. Yeah. For ratings. But they allowed it.

We Wine Whenever (30:04.517)
So then we see Jackie goes over to Danielle's house to help her get ready for her blind date. And his screen name is Gucci model. And she has been having phone sex with him for two years. Two years, two years, two years. Never met him. Yep.

Kelli (30:21.415)
Two years? And she never met him in two years?

Lori (30:21.638)
Eww. Eww.

Kelli (30:29.135)
I mean, I mean, I mean...

We Wine Whenever (30:31.578)
Yeah.

Kelli (30:33.935)
That's a long time.

Lori (30:34.435)
EW

We Wine Whenever (30:36.117)
a long time. And then Teresa shows up too to help, you know, to help Danielle get ready. And, you know, Danielle says that her girls love that she's dating because they like to help her get dressed and pick out her clothes. And, you know, she tells her girls everything, but not the phone sex thing, but they know she's going out on a date. And then Jackie and Teresa decide to go to the restaurant that she's meeting the guy out at to spy on. Yeah, it was.

Kelli (30:47.511)
Yeah

Lori (30:48.572)
Ew.

Kelli (31:01.169)
That was funny with the binoculars.

We Wine Whenever (31:03.703)
Yeah, I mean, and they didn't, she didn't even see them, which I think is odd because there had to be a camera there.

Kelli (31:08.913)
They totally, she totally knew they were there. I wrote the same thing down. There's a camera crew in the corner with your friends with binoculars. You knew they were there, but that's okay. That's okay.

We Wine Whenever (31:12.245)
Yeah, right.

Right. You had to know. Right. But the fact that she waited, what did she wait, two hours or an hour and a half? So he was supposed to be there at 730 and at nine o 'clock she's like, well he didn't show. Would you have waited an hour and a half?

Kelli (31:26.299)
Yeah.

Kelli (31:33.559)
No, but those girls that she was sitting next to were so funny. They were like, you're not calling him, are you? When she called him and left him that message. They're like, you're not calling him, are you? Yeah, she sat there and waited way too long. I would have been like, peace.

We Wine Whenever (31:40.066)
Yeah, Yeah, yeah. Yeah, me too. Me too.

Kelli (31:50.545)
That's never happened to me. Has that ever happened to you guys? I honestly don't think I ever went on a blind date.

We Wine Whenever (31:53.025)
Never ever

Lori (31:54.73)
stood up for Nate.

We Wine Whenever (31:57.825)
I've never been on a blind date. Yeah.

Lori (31:58.971)
on a blind date? yes, I've been on a blind date, but I've never been stood up on a blind date.

Kelli (32:00.59)
Never.

We Wine Whenever (32:05.227)
I've never been stood up or on a blind date.

Kelli (32:05.52)
I went.

I never went on a blind date, I'll tell you what, I worked for a law firm in my early twenties. After my engagement broke up, broke off and before Eric and I started dating, I was single for four years. So I worked for this lawyer and this really good looking guy owned a title company. His father, his parents owned a title company and he worked for it he was really good looking. So the real estate secretary was like, you should go out with him. And I was like, no, no, no. He was a little too corporate for me, but

Lori (32:08.799)
There you go.

Kelli (32:37.955)
Anyway, he did ask me out on a date and I was like,

So we go to, you know, Clark's Landing, but it's now a banquet center, but it used to be a restaurant. So we go there and my friend Ann was a bartender there. So we're sitting at the table. She's like, she's like, give me the thumbs up. And he sits at the table facing the window. And I swear to you, he was checking himself out the whole time. He was looking at himself in the reflection of the window the entire time. Totally turned me off.

Lori (33:05.482)
print.

Lori (33:12.434)
Eww.

Kelli (33:14.255)
So we go home after that, he takes me home and he lived in Long Branch and he made a point to say he lived in a house with a long driveway with a gate. I'm thinking, yeah, your parents' house. But anyway, the next, so that was like a Friday night or a Saturday night, whatever. The following Monday, flowers get sent to the office from this title company. And I was like, my God. They were for the real estate secretary for a closing she did for them.

I never fucking talked to him again. was like, what? Fuck you, bro. You checked yourself out the whole time in the reflection of the mirror and then you the following day after a date, you send her flowers and not me. Never talk to him again. That was the closest thing I ever had to a blind date, but that wasn't really a blind date.

Lori (33:45.886)
No.

We Wine Whenever (34:05.236)
Yeah, no, I've never had a blind date or been stood up. But I can tell you, would not wait an hour and a half.

Kelli (34:11.931)
would not wait an hour and a half.

Lori (34:12.2)
Hell no.

We Wine Whenever (34:16.062)
Then after that, we see Albie's graduation party and like I said, Caroline's running around trying to get them all together and ready. And Dina is talking about how Albie is the golden child and everyone likes him. And she also says how we always have each other's backs, the family.

Then Dean is talking about how Franklin Lakes doesn't have a center of town. So the hair salon is like the center, the chateau. I mean, how is that the center of the town? I mean.

Kelli (34:51.515)
Yeah, like they don't have a grocery store?

We Wine Whenever (34:53.598)
I'm sure they do. I'm sure they do. And so they're having a girls night and she's going to the hair salon to get her hair done with the girls. Right. But Danielle feels the need to show up at the hair salon and sit outside. And Jackie has to say, listen, I don't mean to be rude, but you weren't invited. So you're not coming.

Kelli (35:01.697)
the girls night that Danielle wasn't invited to.

Kelli (35:08.359)
where she does.

Kelli (35:14.918)
Right.

Lori (35:15.976)
Just psycho.

We Wine Whenever (35:17.36)
Yeah, really?

Kelli (35:17.785)
Yeah, that right there you're like, okay.

Lori (35:22.601)
Yeah, you're a grown woman. You're not like busting in on some 14 year olds like birthday party. You're a grown ass woman. Super cringy.

We Wine Whenever (35:22.706)
Yeah.

Kelli (35:24.721)
Flick.

Kelli (35:29.957)
Right. Right.

We Wine Whenever (35:30.651)
Right. Yeah. So then they get into the city and they're talking about like going to Cipriani and Jackie's afraid that Danielle will show up there. So she's like, let's not go there. She didn't tell them that, but she's like, let's go to one, a place called one.

Kelli (35:49.157)
I hope that there was a camera crew waiting at Cipriani's just in case Danielle did show up.

We Wine Whenever (35:53.503)
that would have been good, right? Yeah.

Lori (35:54.954)
Now I'm good.

Kelli (35:55.015)
Amazing.

We Wine Whenever (35:59.91)
So Danielle is just like stirring the pot between, you know, Jackie and Dina. Cause she knows Dina doesn't like her. Dina's made it clear to us in the first episode that she doesn't like her. And...

Kelli (36:07.142)
Yeah.

Kelli (36:12.291)
Yeah. Well, because something happened. They talk about it, but we didn't see it. So this is what leads me to believe that they weren't friends before. Once they all got recruited for the show, they set something up where they all went out and Dina and Danielle got into it. And Dina says, like, I think I told her I was going to kick her ass. So they're, know, when you, I guess this really doesn't matter, but to me,

We Wine Whenever (36:21.348)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (36:30.725)
Yeah.

Kelli (36:38.247)
When you're one of 11 siblings and somebody rubs you the wrong way, you don't, you don't need any more friends. Let's face it. You got 11 siblings. I'm sure you got friends, but you're not, you're not in the market to be, you know, making new friendships. So it's like, okay, we don't get along. So I'm to move on to the next.

We Wine Whenever (36:42.31)
Right.

Lori (36:53.588)
Yeah, you're full up.

We Wine Whenever (36:53.613)
No. Right. Right. Exactly. Exactly. So that's pretty much all I have for episode one. And then episode two, we start out with Jackie is in the kitchen talking to Ashley because Ashley has like fallen behind in her schoolwork and

Kelli (36:59.579)
Yeah.

Kelli (37:14.607)
Let tell you something. I didn't realize how much I was going to identify with Jacqueline until this episode, until this moment in my life. I'm like, my, because I remember Ashley being like a pain in the ass, but I'm like, my God, like I'm Jacqueline. I'm right here with you. Right.

Lori (37:16.34)
Do the hot mess.

We Wine Whenever (37:20.547)
I know.

We Wine Whenever (37:24.462)
Yep.

We Wine Whenever (37:33.816)
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I you know, at this time, Ashley is the same age as our sons are going into their senior year. Like we're we're right there, like having these same conversations. Yeah, I mean, and plus she's got a six year old and she's had four miscarriages like. You know, she's going through a lot. She's going through a lot.

Kelli (37:42.64)
Hmm.

Kelli (37:49.585)
Yep.

Kelli (38:01.445)
Let me ask you something. If you had, this is a very personal question, but if you had four miscarriages, would you continue to try? If you had two already had two healthy kids.

We Wine Whenever (38:14.076)
I think I would, yeah.

Lori (38:17.012)
I think I would too.

We Wine Whenever (38:18.734)
Yeah, I think I would.

Lori (38:20.924)
If that's what I really wanted, if that's what my husband and I really wanted, then I think I would.

Kelli (38:21.285)
I don't think I would. That's why I asked.

We Wine Whenever (38:23.064)
Yeah, I

Kelli (38:30.331)
Okay.

We Wine Whenever (38:31.99)
Yeah, I think I would too. So she's planning, you she's talking to her daughter Ashley. She's planning the birthday party for CJ. And this is actually the episode where Teresa takes the girls shopping and they're running around like lunatics in the store. And she even says to the lady, Gia and Gabriella are easy to handle, but Melania is going through her terrible twos. I'm like, hmm.

Kelli (39:00.113)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (39:00.948)
no, girl, it is more than that. She's just a big personality. She is a big personality.

Kelli (39:02.818)
Yeah, it's definitely more than that.

Lori (39:04.362)
It's an ongoing problem.

Kelli (39:07.431)
Yeah, yeah. a kid like that, you put a camera in front of their face, they're gonna eat it all up. For sure.

We Wine Whenever (39:16.278)
Yep. Yep. And even, even back then, cause that's where they get the call for Gia that she's got this audition. Gia wanted to be a star. I mean, you know, her mother says she's not a stage mom and her mom's kind of pushing this, but Gia wanted it. You know, Gia wanted it.

Kelli (39:32.197)
Definitely. Yeah, I don't think that Teresa was making her do anything she wasn't totally on board with and They were obviously doing that before the show started because she had already had an agent She had already had those pictures taken so that was already going on before the show started

We Wine Whenever (39:44.811)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (39:50.859)
Yeah, I mean, she got the audition before the show started, because we heard about it that, you know.

Kelli (39:53.659)
Yeah.

Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (39:58.208)
So then what else? Then Jackie meets up with Danielle for lunch and Danielle feels like she's close to Jackie, but she wants to fit in with the other girls. And she's kind of like asking her like to kind of help her with Dina.

Kelli (40:19.793)
Do you kind of feel bad for Danielle right now? Like, it is not at all, huh?

We Wine Whenever (40:22.996)
I don't. I didn't because honestly I saw right through her. I saw right, yeah I...

Lori (40:23.402)
Yeah.

Kelli (40:29.029)
Yeah, I know. And the rest of them did too. I might have been like Jaclyn though. I might have been like, come on guys.

We Wine Whenever (40:36.768)
I think you honestly, think you would have been like Jacqueline and I would and and Laurie and I and Laurie and I would have been like, -mm. Yep. Yep. Yeah. No, I don't because.

Kelli (40:39.301)
think I would have. I think I would have.

Lori (40:40.532)
Kelly, Kelly definitely would have been like that.

Kelli (40:43.919)
Yeah, and you guys would have been like, she's fucking crazy. Get away from her. Yeah, it's true.

Lori (40:52.916)
Because Kelly, you're super nice like that. So you definitely would have been like that. Me and Wendy would have been like, no, this bitch is crazy. We're not doing this.

Kelli (40:57.167)
I am.

We Wine Whenever (41:01.077)
Yep. And then Teresa goes back again to the house that she's building again. And I think this might be when she calls her designer and wants to change the railings that just arrived. The wrought iron. I'm like, my God, are you kidding me? Like, does she have any idea what she's doing?

Kelli (41:01.093)
Yeah, we're out. She's not invited.

Lori (41:21.35)
yeah, I remember that.

Kelli (41:27.929)
And she says like, love them. think they're beautiful, but I want to go back to the other one.

Lori (41:28.019)
No.

We Wine Whenever (41:32.084)
Right.

Lori (41:34.772)
Mmm.

We Wine Whenever (41:37.2)
Ugh, I would not want to be working with her. I could just say that.

Kelli (41:40.102)
No.

Lori (41:40.126)
Can you imagine, can you imagine how much money she spent on that house?

Kelli (41:44.325)
Well, it's it's interesting that Dina, her good friend, is an interior designer, but not doing the interior design of her house, right?

We Wine Whenever (41:52.904)
Well, cause she knows she couldn't work with Teresa cause Teresa's a lunatic. And as we see later on when she's doing her ladybug event, Dina can be a bit of a bitch. Right? So I don't think that they would work well together.

Kelli (41:55.311)
Right. Right. Right.

Kelli (42:03.183)
yeah, yeah, yeah.

Lori (42:04.173)
yeah.

He was tracking that weapon.

Kelli (42:09.179)
But I think you have to be like that to pull one of those. That was a huge event. A lot of vendors, a lot of moving parts. You kind of have to have that personality to pull something like that off.

We Wine Whenever (42:15.197)
It was.

We Wine Whenever (42:22.29)
I agree you have to be on top of things and organize, but I don't know that you have to be snapping at your family members. And if you wanted them to work it, don't just assume they're going to work it. Give them a job and say, listen, can you help me with this?

Kelli (42:37.509)
Yeah, yeah, because I felt bad for Jacqueline.

We Wine Whenever (42:39.634)
Well, because you would again, you would have been Jacqueline because you would have been Jacqueline and Lori and I would have been like, listen, if you wanted me to help you, all you had to do was ask, stop snapping at me like this. You know, I was coming as a guest. You want me to help? I'll help. Don't be a bitch. Like that's all we would have said. And you would be running around like Jacqueline.

Kelli (42:43.45)
Yes.

Lori (42:44.127)
Yes.

Kelli (42:49.783)
Right. Right. Right. Yeah.

Right. Right.

Lori (42:56.222)
Right. Right.

Kelli (43:00.069)
Yeah. I'm like, what the fuck, man? I paid to be here. Now I gotta work it?

Lori (43:04.052)
Right. Me and Wendy would have been like, stop your shit and just tell us what you need done and let's move this the fuck along.

Kelli (43:05.945)
Alright!

We Wine Whenever (43:08.176)
Right. Right.

Right. Let's see. so then we get to CJ's birthday party, right? We see Teresa arrive with her kids all dressed to match and they're, you know, she's got the carnival theme and she's got the bouncy house and the petting zoo and the clowns and God knows what else she's. Yeah, I mean, it was a, it was a three ring circus basically is what she had going on in her yard. She literally had a three ring circus going on.

Kelli (43:15.111)
Correct.

Kelli (43:32.891)
The guy on the stilts.

Kelli (43:37.845)
-huh.

We Wine Whenever (43:41.808)
And in the midst of all of it, Danielle feels the need to go up to her. Jacqueline, have you seen your sister, your sister -in -law, Dina? And Jackie's like, yeah, she just came. Well, I want.

Kelli (43:50.885)
wait, but before that, before that, when they're setting the tables up and Danielle's daughter says, or Danielle says, know, Christina told me that Ashley's having friends over. I, I remember watching that scene back in the day and I was like, why is she inserting? Let me tell you something right now. If that were my house and that were my daughter and somebody tried to do that with me, go up to her room and talk,

We Wine Whenever (43:56.601)
yes, yes, yes.

Yes. Yes.

Yes.

Kelli (44:20.601)
Eric would be like, what the fuck are you doing? I mean, I don't know where Chris was, but he'd be like, this is our problem, not yours. You can go fuck and walk away now. Like he would never let somebody else, you know, reprimand my kid or get involved in a situation like that ever. He'd be pissed.

We Wine Whenever (44:31.185)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (44:42.244)
Yeah. I mean, Jackie should have said, I got this, you know, but Jackie, Jackie just doesn't do that. I was, you're right.

Kelli (44:46.502)
Yup.

Kelli (44:50.171)
When she was like, do you want me to come up there with you? I would have been like, no. First of all, my husband will kill you. And second of all, it's my daughter. I can handle it. But Jacqueline's like, well, if you think that'll help, like what?

We Wine Whenever (44:54.294)
No, no I don't.

We Wine Whenever (44:59.043)
Right, right, right.

We Wine Whenever (45:05.103)
Yeah, that was ridiculous. It was ridiculous. You're right. That was totally over the top. I mean, and Ashley was being a bitch and she shouldn't have invited all of her friends over there. And Jackie had a very valid point. You know, she can't watch teenagers from drinking while she's got six year olds running around and animals. Absolutely. 100%, 100%.

Lori (45:05.566)
Yeah, no.

Kelli (45:11.686)
Yeah.

For sure.

Kelli (45:23.077)
And they definitely would have been drinking. I mean, it's obvious. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (45:30.647)
And then after that whole incident, then that's when she goes up to her and says, you think it's okay if I go talk to Dina? And she's like, yeah, I guess. And then she goes over to Dina and gives her a big hug and is like, I'm sorry. I'm like, are you kidding me? We're friends. Can I borrow your boobs since we're friends now? What? I mean, she takes it. She really is a psycho.

Lori (45:48.008)
Best friends now.

Kelli (45:49.574)
Yeah.

Kelli (45:54.747)
Yeah.

Lori (45:56.394)
She's a psycho.

We Wine Whenever (45:59.587)
She really is.

Lori (46:01.0)
And you know who else is really a psycho, but she's like a closet psycho, is Teresa. When she flipped that table, let me tell you something, I was like, whoa, I always do that. I'm just saying.

We Wine Whenever (46:09.752)
All right, we're not there. You're jumping ahead. We're not there yet. We're not there yet. But then even Dina says in her confessional, she's like, yeah. Dina says in her confessional, like, I think she wants to be me. Like, I'm afraid she's gonna skin me and wear me like a Versace. Like, I keep seeing it in my head. Yeah, I was like, my God. She's right, she's a psycho.

Kelli (46:16.741)
I agree with you though.

Kelli (46:26.149)
Last year's Versace. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, Yeah. I think Danielle just desperately wanted to be in with them because we learned like there were a lot of rumors about her that she was a husband stealer. She was this, she was that. Like she just wanted to be in with them, but she doesn't know how. She comes on too strong and that's just who she is. And that's why you either love her or hate her.

And I would imagine that Danielle goes through friends quite quickly because she comes on way too strong. I've had friends like that. It's not sustainable.

Lori (47:05.96)
Yeah. Well, you know, listen, she was somebody who was, you know, a former stripper who married some guy with lots of dough. You're going to and was abandoned by her mother. She's just crazy insecure, crazy insecure to the point to the point that it makes her behave like that's why she behaves like that.

Kelli (47:24.165)
Yep, she's got a lot going on.

Kelli (47:30.523)
for sure. Well, you're right. Like it really comes down to the insecurity of being abandoned by your mother. Basically, that's what it comes down to. So every time a relationship ends, she feels that loss all over again.

Lori (47:43.09)
It's another abandonment.

Kelli (47:47.845)
And it's sad. That's sad.

Lori (47:49.65)
It is, it is sad, but she is not.

Kelli (47:53.443)
Yeah. And maybe maybe the Manzos should have been a little bit more empathetic to that. what but her behavior like almost prevents that from them being empathetic, because I think Dina, I mean, we see you see in the second season that Dina does try to be empathetic. And open the door for her again.

We Wine Whenever (47:54.167)
Yeah.

Lori (48:18.033)
yeah.

Kelli (48:22.288)
and it just doesn't work out.

Lori (48:22.58)
But like I said, she just, she's such a mess that she just cannot help but self -sabotage herself with her own kooky shit she's got in her head thinking everybody's after her and, you know, tramps around with little leprechaun bodyguards and hell's angels. Just stop it, stop it, stop it, stop it, stop it.

Kelli (48:31.269)
Yes.

Kelli (48:45.053)
my God, that's season two. Tommy Provenzano. Tommy? No.

Lori (48:51.006)
Bobby. I think the kid's name was Bobby. Yeah, the little guy that you always had around with her. I think his name was, I think his name was Bobby. There's all kinds of memes about him.

We Wine Whenever (48:53.14)
Bobby?

Kelli (48:58.021)
Yeah, yeah, why can't I think of his name?

Kelli (49:03.865)
I know his last name was Provenzano.

We Wine Whenever (49:08.254)
All right, well, when we get there, I'll write it down, because I'm taking notes on each episode. I'll let you know. Stop jumping ahead. After that, we see Caroline's in the kitchen cooking with Lauren, and they're making sausage and potatoes. And, you know, her house is all are welcome. She never knows how many she's cooking for. So she just cooks.

Lori (49:10.948)
Okay. You do that, Wendy.

Kelli (49:13.561)
Alright.

Kelli (49:19.215)
I know, it's so hard not to though.

Kelli (49:35.824)
And she says how many pounds of pasta should I make one or two you got fucking seven people sitting at the table Caroline you make the two pounds of pasta what's it cost? Even if you're making the fresh pasta for crying out loud

We Wine Whenever (49:47.72)
I thought it was odd she was making pasta when she was making sausage and potatoes. Is she having pasta and sausage and potatoes? That's way too many starches.

Kelli (49:55.107)
I have to be honest with you, if I make sausage, peppers and potatoes, I don't make pasta. But if I just make sausage and peppers, I make pasta. So I agree with you there. It's a lot of starch. But when you are cooking for the masses, as Caroline said, perhaps the more starch, the better.

Lori (49:55.188)
Yeah, a lot of carbs.

We Wine Whenever (50:02.982)
Okay, okay.

We Wine Whenever (50:09.063)
Yeah.

That's true. That is true. That's when they're sitting at the table. Christopher asks, if you could have two kids instead of three, which two would it be? Again, I laugh so hard and that is something my son Andrew would ask. Like that's a question Andrew would ask me. Like he asks me crazy questions all the time. And I like Christopher a lot. I would like to see Christopher again. I want to know what Christopher's doing. I'm going to now stalk Christopher.

Kelli (50:22.456)
my God, that's that was so funny.

Kelli (50:30.575)
Yeah. Yeah.

Kelli (50:36.303)
Yes, I do too.

I follow his Instagram. He's doing something with a pizza place. I think he's running a pizza place up North Jersey

We Wine Whenever (50:41.871)
you do? all right. All right. Well, OK, well, I got to follow him on WeWine whenever so he can see what he's doing.

Kelli (50:49.521)
Do you ever, is Dear Albie still a podcast? Cause I used to listen to that all the time, Dear Albie. It was a great podcast. And I'll tell you who one of my favorite people was on that they would have on their cousin Candice. And prior to Melissa coming on the show, Candice was going to be a housewife. Caroline's niece. She's hysterical.

We Wine Whenever (50:56.326)
I don't know. I do not know.

We Wine Whenever (51:05.458)
I

We Wine Whenever (51:11.464)
interesting. Very interesting.

Kelli (51:16.155)
But her husband, I don't know if he's a teacher still, but he was a teacher at the time and he had his sights set on being in administration for the school systems. And they were kind of like, I don't think you want to get involved in this if that's really where you're going. And she didn't.

We Wine Whenever (51:32.036)
Right, right.

Lori (51:34.194)
No, those two do not mix.

Kelli (51:36.537)
Right, right. So she chose not to do it. But she's hysterical on that. It's a good podcast.

We Wine Whenever (51:36.716)
No. No.

We Wine Whenever (51:42.15)
I don't know, I've never listened to it. I'll have to see if it's still out there. I never listened to it. So then after that, see Teresa brings Gia to her acting coach so she can get ready for this big audition. And Caroline and Al have a sit down with Lauren about going to beauty school because they wanted to have some direction. And he says he knows someone who owns a beauty school and a spa and

Kelli (51:45.659)
Yeah, I'm gonna look now. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (52:10.042)
You know, she's like, I like doing makeup, but I don't know about hair. Like I don't, I don't want to like touch people. Christopher's like.

Kelli (52:17.233)
Okay, just FYI, Dear Albie is still on podcast on Apple podcasts and it's current. You know, it's interesting. Yeah, three days ago was his last one. It's interesting because Caroline was like, well, if you're going to do it, you're going to get the whole thing. And there are just licenses for estheticians. So I don't know why. Like if that was really what she only wanted to do. Like, I don't know.

We Wine Whenever (52:23.487)
They're still putting out episodes?

Kelli (52:43.525)
I don't know why they forced her into doing the whole, cause it's a long program.

We Wine Whenever (52:48.806)
I mean, what is it, nine months?

Kelli (52:53.279)
Well, I guess if you go full time, like I did it through high school half day and it was two years, but

We Wine Whenever (52:56.088)
Yeah, yeah, I think it's a nine month, I think it's a nine month program. And I think what her mom was saying is learn it all. And then, you know, get your license and everything. And she wanted to do makeup, not so much facials. So that's not, you know, there's not really a license to be a makeup artist. So she was saying, you know, get yourself the license. You can open up your own place because you need a license or you're to have to rely on somebody else's license. You know?

Kelli (53:04.752)
Yeah

Kelli (53:11.174)
Right.

Kelli (53:24.323)
Right. Right.

We Wine Whenever (53:25.987)
I think it was sound advice, I'll be honest with you. And it was, like I said, it was not, she's 20 years old. She's been off for two years. you know, get yourself a license. What else? So then Danielle calls her ex up on the phone and she's talking to him on her flip phone and saying how it's been two years and they still don't have a settlement. I don't understand that. How is she living in that house?

Kelli (53:28.742)
Yeah.

Kelli (53:33.595)
Right.

Kelli (53:55.939)
He must have been paying the bills on the house. He must have been paying the mortgage and the taxes on the house. And maybe that was it. I don't know. He must have been paying for something. She didn't work. And she like he must have been buying her groceries and paying her electric bill. She did not work. He had to be paying all the bills at that point. Like, what are you looking for?

We Wine Whenever (54:10.658)
I know.

Or maybe she was making money being a phone sex operator.

Kelli (54:17.733)
Yeah, like, go get a job! Like the fuckin' rest of us!

We Wine Whenever (54:21.643)
Mm -hmm.

Lori (54:23.711)
of me.

We Wine Whenever (54:26.146)
Then we see Jackie's on her way to go to the fertility doctor. I thought her daughter was going with her, which I thought was odd because she's talking to her daughter on the way there and then she tells her to stay in the car. I'm like, well, why did she even come with you to sit in the car? I thought that was a little weird. The other thing I thought was weird is when the doctor came in the office, they kissed each other. And she said she found out about this doctor from Danielle.

Kelli (54:39.151)
that in the car. Yeah.

Exactly. Right.

Kelli (54:54.319)
Yeah, I remember that.

We Wine Whenever (54:54.603)
So it's not like it's a doctor, it's not like it's been her doctor for a long time and she feels like, do you kiss your doctor? I've never kissed my doctor. Right?

Lori (55:01.128)
No. No. Never have kissed any doctors of mine. Never.

Kelli (55:03.079)
I don't think I've kissed my doctor. No, I've never kissed my doctor.

We Wine Whenever (55:08.929)
Am I the only one who thought that was weird?

Kelli (55:11.527)
I didn't even notice, I'll be honest with you.

Lori (55:13.758)
Yeah, I didn't notice either.

We Wine Whenever (55:13.993)
Yeah. Okay. Yeah. No.

Kelli (55:16.103)
I mean, I'm a hugger and a kisser, but I've never kissed my doctor. Any of them, for that matter.

We Wine Whenever (55:21.653)
Yeah, I thought that was a little weird.

Kelli (55:25.977)
Agreed.

Lori (55:27.164)
And not any doctor that has anything to do with my VJJ. No.

Kelli (55:30.765)
Right. Right. Right.

If you see my trotch and you're not my husband, we probably shouldn't kiss.

We Wine Whenever (55:38.217)
Yeah. Yeah. No, I, yeah, I thought that was weird. and then Jackie starts talking about, know, she's had the four miscarriages and the most recent one was only a month ago. And listen, that's tough. That's tough. And she wants to be excited about being pregnant, but she can't because she's so afraid that she's going to lose it.

Kelli (56:02.309)
Yeah, that's awful.

We Wine Whenever (56:03.775)
Yeah. And again, I feel for her. I definitely feel for her because I can't imagine having four miscarriages. I just can't. I can't imagine it.

Kelli (56:08.049)
Yeah.

Kelli (56:13.943)
That's what I mean. Like, it's that's a lot. That's a lot to put yourself through. I think I would be like, I just can't do it anymore. You know, like, let's stop trying and just see what happens. You know, let's stop putting such an emphasis on it and see what happens.

We Wine Whenever (56:31.837)
Yeah. Then we see Dina is interviewing this kid to be her assistant. That was so weird. It was weird and cringing.

Lori (56:38.654)
That was weird and very cringy, very cringy.

Kelli (56:43.247)
He was a family friend.

We Wine Whenever (56:44.999)
Yeah, I know. She's paying him in hugs.

Lori (56:46.493)
even cringier.

Kelli (56:49.689)
you

We Wine Whenever (56:50.399)
paying him in hugs, I'm like, God. Yeah, yeah. Then we see Danielle is going on this date with Steve and her kids are, and the kids are helping her get ready and they're picking out her dress.

Lori (56:52.708)
Ew, it was so cringy. It was so cringy.

Kelli (56:54.833)
That was cringy. Cringy.

Kelli (57:04.753)
my god, I forgot about this!

Kelli (57:11.353)
You could tell her older daughter wanted nothing to do with this scene. Nothing. And she's like, they always help me. they're like, and she's like, yeah, we always help you.

We Wine Whenever (57:15.153)
Yeah, I'm

We Wine Whenever (57:20.991)
So Steve is 26 and she's 45. And he looked like an old 26 boy.

Kelli (57:24.496)
Yeah.

He did look like a whole 26th. He did! He - Yeah, yeah, he looked like a tired 26th.

We Wine Whenever (57:32.423)
Right?

He sure did. He sure did.

Kelli (57:41.221)
And he was friends with Joe Judice?

We Wine Whenever (57:44.127)
But that whole situation was weird, was so weird. And then they go out to dinner at the Highlawn Pavilion. I've been there one time for a wedding. I mean, it is a gorgeous place, but the conversation she's having with him about going to the bathroom and having a quickie.

Lori (58:02.247)
EW.

Kelli (58:02.395)
Yeah, like this is a high end place, Danielle.

We Wine Whenever (58:04.408)
Yeah, like you're not at the diner. Like, are you kidding me? I don't know. She robs me the wrong way.

Kelli (58:08.881)
Right.

Lori (58:11.902)
Well, I think that was just a booty call. That whole relationship was a booty call on both sides. I don't think either one is any less guilty. I think that was a booty call all the way around.

Kelli (58:15.921)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Kelli (58:28.345)
Yeah, and she was just doing that, like trying to get him in the bathroom to be salacious, you know? Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (58:33.487)
Yeah.

So it ends with the Project Ladybug event at the Brownstone and we see Dina is running around like a lunatic and...

Kelli (58:47.271)
Okay, so we see Jacqueline talking to Ashley and she's like, why do you keep changing? Like she's like, Ashley is supposed to be working and she keeps changing. And then we see Dina going, she's fired. She's totally fired. Was she talking about Ashley?

We Wine Whenever (59:03.971)
I don't know.

Kelli (59:05.839)
I know, I was like, I'd never put that together.

Lori (59:07.004)
I think so.

I think so.

We Wine Whenever (59:11.708)
I don't know. I mean...

Kelli (59:11.747)
Right? I think so too! I think so too.

We Wine Whenever (59:16.284)
does she keep changing? I guess because she's a 17 year old.

Kelli (59:19.601)
Yeah, but come on!

We Wine Whenever (59:21.21)
I know.

Kelli (59:23.643)
Just go fucking help your aunt and stop the nonsense!

Lori (59:25.833)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (59:28.485)
Right, right.

And then Jackie, then Teresa shows up and I guess she didn't expect to be working either or she said she would help her, but again, didn't really know what her job was. And then Jackie's, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I mean, listen, it all went off. You know, I think she probably made a ton of money for her project and she had did mention that Danielle didn't want to.

Kelli (59:43.151)
Yeah, but Teresa did just kind of roll with it. She was like, okay, I'll do, you know, whatever.

We Wine Whenever (59:59.994)
spend the money to come there. So that's why Danielle wasn't there because she didn't want to give money to kids with cancer. And she, Dina also made a dig at Jackie and Teresa that they don't understand the stress of having a career. What, really? Was that necessary?

Kelli (01:00:06.211)
Yeah, that was, that wasn't nice.

Kelli (01:00:21.699)
It wasn't because I don't, mean, I do remember Teresa saying that she had a career before she had kids, which, you know, that's admirable anyway. And then you became a stay at home mom, no problem. But Jacqueline was a single mom in Las Vegas and did have a career as a cosmetologist and had a daughter. So a young daughter, a little daughter. So that was a nasty dig.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:43.362)
Right. Right.

Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Kelli (01:00:50.661)
Listen, I was never a big fan of Dina. I always thought Dina had a very uppity I'm better than you attitude about all of them. Even her own family.

We Wine Whenever (01:00:58.466)
I I agree.

No, I agree with that. I was never a big fan of Dina's either.

Lori (01:01:05.0)
Yes. She did seem a little uppity.

Kelli (01:01:06.595)
No, but she was on that VH1 show, My Big Fat Whatever Wedding. I will, I totally believe that that was a marriage of convenience. We never once saw Tommy on Real Housewives. Never once. And she was married to him the first two seasons she was on. And then she talked about the divorce in season six when the twins from Koltznek was on, right? Wasn't that when she was getting divorced?

Lori (01:01:10.74)
Mm -hmm.

We Wine Whenever (01:01:18.712)
No, no, we didn't.

We Wine Whenever (01:01:33.056)
Yeah, I think it was. Yeah.

Kelli (01:01:34.561)
That was totally a marriage of convenience. totally believe. I had never heard that before, but I totally believe it.

We Wine Whenever (01:01:40.204)
No, I do too.

Lori (01:01:40.714)
Well, I was reading some stuff on, well, that's, that's season two. So we'll get to that later. No, won't skip. I won't skip, Wendy. I won't skip.

We Wine Whenever (01:01:46.04)
You were not jumping a whole season, Lori.

Hmm.

Kelli (01:01:54.993)
All right, that's it.

We Wine Whenever (01:01:56.688)
That's it, but I want to tell you some, I have two funny things I learned recently. I was out with my girlfriends and we were out drinking as we do. And I did, she wasn't our bartender that time, but she was there. So we were splitting, we split a slice of pizza in three and then we...

Kelli (01:02:08.039)
Did you see our favorite bartender?

Kelli (01:02:20.203)
One slice of pizza? I mean, I know they're big at the sawmill, but you literally split one slice of pizza.

We Wine Whenever (01:02:22.679)
Yeah.

Yeah, in three. And we get French fries with cheese on the side and we get coconut shrimp. We always order the coconut. We always order the coconut shrimp and 90 % of the time we never get it. So I said, well, we might as order it. Maybe we'll get it this time. Maybe we won't. So all the food comes out and my one friend is sitting to the right of me, Pam and Jerilyn and sitting to the left of me and Pam's eating her pizza and they're

Kelli (01:02:31.868)
Okay. Okay.

We Wine Whenever (01:02:50.294)
Gerald and Pam are very much into their condiments and they're looking they're like, there's no salt I was like you don't need salt on the pizza. She's like, yeah, you're right. It's it's too salty then I'm not paying attention and Gerald and asked the bartender to get her salt and she's getting salt and she's putting salt on the coconut shrimp I was like, what are you doing? You don't need salt. So I take the salt away from her and I give it to the bartender I'm like take the salt away Pam's like

Look at us. We used to go out and we'd stop each other from doing shots. Now we're stopping each other from having sauce.

Lori (01:03:21.051)
from doing the salt.

Kelli (01:03:22.695)
That's funny. That's very funny.

We Wine Whenever (01:03:25.543)
I was like, my God, this is podcast material. First, I have to write it down because I will not remember it. So I did. And then the other thing was we were out and she was telling me what I didn't know this. Do you know what strictly like when a relationship is strictly business, do you know what that means? I never heard of this before. Laura, have you ever heard of this strictly business? So strictly business is what we called friends with benefits.

Kelli (01:03:28.849)
Yes!

Kelli (01:03:42.961)
No.

We Wine Whenever (01:03:52.807)
Now they call it strictly business. Did you? I never heard of that.

Kelli (01:03:53.537)
okay.

never heard of it, but it does make sense. So it's just people who have sex with each other.

We Wine Whenever (01:04:00.137)
Yeah, that doesn't make sense. That's Friends with Benefits. Why are you calling that strictly business?

Lori (01:04:03.155)
Yeah.

Kelli (01:04:04.337)
Cause you're just, you're just getting down to business. You're just, you just want to have sex with this person and nothing else. Strictly business. I get it.

We Wine Whenever (01:04:07.283)
Business?

Lori (01:04:07.786)
Goodness. Goodness.

We Wine Whenever (01:04:11.549)
Okay. All right. All right. So anyway, I learned that. So I learned about strictly business and I learned that, at our age, it's

Kelli (01:04:19.344)
Is this a thing with kids our our kids ages? Okay.

Lori (01:04:19.484)
You're old and you gotta fight about salt.

We Wine Whenever (01:04:22.901)
Yeah, yeah, I would think so. Yeah

Kelli (01:04:26.575)
And now we have to ask our kids if they know what this is. Well, I'm not going to ask Joe, but I'll ask Tess.

We Wine Whenever (01:04:29.045)
I'm not asking my kids this. mean, they already cringe every time they hear me talk as it is. I'm not going to ask them about that.

Kelli (01:04:36.135)
I'll ask Tess. We'll ask Tess tonight.

Lori (01:04:40.372)
So I want to know, how was Atlantic City?

Kelli (01:04:46.002)
didn't you listen to the podcast, Laura?

We Wine Whenever (01:04:48.103)
Lori, okay, well, I'm sorry. We're not recapping it now for you. You can listen to the podcast like everybody else.

Kelli (01:04:53.413)
These poor people have already heard about it, but we'll tell you separately.

Lori (01:04:53.598)
I'll have to listen to the program. Okay. Okay. Good. Good. Good.

We Wine Whenever (01:04:57.999)
No, I'm not telling her. She could listen to the damn podcast. Give us a download for Christ sakes. Sorry, I gotta cut that out. Sorry, I can't speak that way. But Lori!

Lori (01:05:00.927)
Peace.

Lori (01:05:08.308)
But I didn't listen to what I to tell you.

Hmm.

We Wine Whenever (01:05:14.503)
I'm my head at you, Lori. I'm shaking my head. For the listeners, I'm shaking my head at Lori.

Kelli (01:05:14.907)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Lori (01:05:17.513)
I know.

Kelli (01:05:20.485)
Yeah.

Lori (01:05:20.574)
Yeah, well, that's what happens with me.

We Wine Whenever (01:05:23.909)
I know. All right, until next time, thank you for watching and listening to We Wine Whenever. I'm Wendy.

Lori (01:05:25.684)
can't help it.

Kelli (01:05:30.477)
I'm Kelly. Bye.

Lori (01:05:31.548)
And I'm Laurie.

We Wine Whenever (01:05:33.713)
Bye.